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40g Breeder Build - Stand Mockup

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    Posted: May 20 2010 at 11:47am
So I think I am going to pick up my 40g breeder tank this weekend and start my summer long tank project, for now I am going to paint the back either a metallic dark blue, or just flat black to match my overflow.

Here is the list of things I am going to buy, although if anyone has any suggestions, I would most certainly appreciate them.


40g breeder with custom overflow (Herbie style)
20g high sump
Custom Built Stand


The things I need help deciding on is:

Lighting, I am thinking of going with the TEK 6x39w 36" T5 setup 

unless someone can convince me to go with a DIY LED fixture

What skimmer? (something rated around 100g?)


Suggested GPH for return pump? and What size of holes/bulkheads should I go with?

(was thinking 1" with a Quiet One 3000 or Mag Drive 7)


And last but not least, 1 Vortech MP20 or 2 MP10

Thanks again for the help!




Edited by Ahanix - May 22 2010 at 10:19pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fishoutawater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2010 at 1:43pm
That looks like a sweet list. My only suggestion is to get a 65gal instead. I have a 40 breeder and love the foot print, but would really like another 6-7inches of height.
 
If you are doing a Herbie overflow/drain, a 3/4" main drain will handle the flow you are talking about. I would use a 1" for the backup drain. I would also suggest a gate valve to adjust your primary drain. I have a ball valve on mine and it is a pita to adjust.
 
The ASM G1 would handle that system, I may be sellling mine soon. It's the only one I have seen with a bubble plate and it definitely makes a difference. I would shoot for a skimmer that approximately processes the same amount of flow that your return pump pushes.
 
There are lots of LED build threads out there, for the money you spend on a TEK fixture you could easily do your own LED build and make it exactly the way you want.


Edited by fishoutawater - May 20 2010 at 1:45pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bugzme Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2010 at 2:20pm
I think led's are too new right now! I would go with the t-5's.
I have 6 bulbs and I can make my tank go all kinds of colors
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tcfab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 20 2010 at 8:50pm
You might want to look into the new SWC cones, they are priced really well and have been getting good reviews. My brother just ordered the 160. As far as a return pump goes, Magdrives are nice but they are loud you might want to look into Ehiem pumps they are dead silent. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ksmart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 21 2010 at 12:18am
I have a 40 gal breeder and I love it. On lighting I have a 175 watt mh and 2 24 inch vho's for actinics and I love the color that I get. You may want to consider something similar. It was pretty cheap to rig up the only downfall with retrofit lighting is that you will need something to house them in and I was too lazy and didnt have the tools to build a canopy so I got one through Aquatic Dreams (which Dion makes) and I am very happy with it. If you decide to stick with the 40 breeder I would recommend having a tall stand for better viewing. My stand is 2 feet 3-1/2 inches tall and it kinda sucks, its nice when I need to get into the tank but its not good for viewing.






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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ahanix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 21 2010 at 12:24am
Yeah, I have access to about every wood working tool imaginable, so I am going to make my own stand. 

I'm not sure on the measurements quite yet, but i'm going to make the stand atleast as high as my countertops in my house, as a guess it would put the tank around 6 feet tall with the canopy (i'm 6'3" so I really don't want to have to bend down to stare at my tank)

I found this stand that is currently being built on RC that I probably will copy, with two doors in the front




Edited by Ahanix - May 21 2010 at 12:25am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Thompson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 21 2010 at 10:22am
Alright here is my suggestion!

Get your lazy butt here to my apartment and come see my 40 gallon breeder!

You are in Spanish Fork so it is like a 15 minute drive at the most to Provo where I live.

Here are my recommendations from experience with the exact tank:

1) If you can get the Illuminata 58g tank. It is rimless and 21" tall. A 65 is WAY too tall IMO. I HATE 24" tall tanks when it comes to doing any any type of work on them. I love the 16" height on my tank but the extra 4 or 5 inches would have been nice not to mention the rimless look.

2) For lighting, get the Tek or ATI Sunpower in the 24" version not the 36". You will have a lot of wasted light going with a 36" and may honestly have a hard time keeping some lower light corals in the tank. If you don't think a 24" fixture can handle a 36" tank, come on over. I will show you my SPS that is on the side glass that is growing and looks great still.

3) As far as overflow goes, make it the absolute smallest you can and put it in the corner. Drill the back glass and have the return come through there. I love my coast to coast but I gave up 4 inches of real estate from front to back. Pretty much killed the reason why I went with a 40 breeder.

4) I still say avoid LED lighting. So people have had success for 6 months with them? I follow A LOT of LED stuff on Nano Reef and Reef Central. Some common things I find are a) some corals will never last under them but others thrive and b) those having good success are really experienced reefers that keep water levels perfect at ALL times.

I talked To Evil on Nano Reef and he said himself that LED are the future but there are certain colors that LED may never be able to hit and that adding T5's was the best option. He told me a few stories of different corals that looked great in his buddies tanks but when he got them under LED, he couldn't get them to last. He isn't sure what to do for some corals under them.

5) Go with 2 MP10. A single powerhead is really hard to scape around. To get good flow throughout the tank you have to turn it up. That then just made it so you can't place any corals within 6 inches of the powerhead. Get 2 of them and turn them down to both 60% or so and you will get great flow everywhere.

6) I LOVE my Bubble Magus skimmer. I have the NAC6 on my 40 breeder with only 2 fish and it pulls skim out all the time. I agree with Tyler above to look into the SWC cones. They are really good skimmers for the price.

Okay I have to go to work now but feel free to call, text, PM or come over and check out my system if you have any questions.

Ryan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fishoutawater Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 21 2010 at 11:04am
How bout an external overflow? Great surface skimming, no footprint.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ahanix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 21 2010 at 12:03pm
Thanks for all of your responses


I decided on a 40g breeder because of the footprint.

I wanted something around 36" long, but it had to be deep, and not too tall.  don't ask me why, but for some reason I like to be able to reach the bottom of my tank LOL

I was looking at the illuminata, but I would rather spend the extra money on stuff for the tank, that and my wife refuses for me to have an open top tank, so I have to build a canopy for this to match the look of the rest of our furniture.

Thats awesome that I can go with the 24" version, now that changes everything I have been looking at.  i'll still go with either TEK or ATI, but now i'm not sure of which LOL

When the time comes to put this tank together and get it running (calculating time to make the stand, get funds to finish everything the way I want to do it) i'm looking at October.

I figured for now I can get the tank, paint the back and get the acrylic overflow built/installed, find the rock I want and get my stand built/ plumbing done. 

Since I have a bit of time, I'm thinking about either making my own rock, or just buying dead rock and cooking it until my tank is ready to go. 



Speaking of overflows though, is this what you are talking about?





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan Thompson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 22 2010 at 1:05pm
For lighting I am not sure I would go with a fixture inside a canopy unless you plan to really ventilate the hood. The ATI fixtures especially need fresh air from the top and then an opening on the side to let the hot air out. Again you are more than welcome to come take a look at my Sunpower and see what you think.

AS far as an overflow goes, I am not sure how well a herbie drain would work on a box that small. The level in my overflow fluctuates throughout the day so that small of a box may have problems but I am not sure.

I wish I would have gone with a corner overflow that housed my drain and emergency drain. Then put the return through the glass on the black, but that is just me.

Your setup and plans look really good! Be patient and do EXACTLY what you want. Cut ANY corners now and I promise you will regret it later. It took me 2 years to collect everything for this tank and get all the plans in order. I rushed the overflow idea and now that is the only thing that bothers me but I have worked around it and no harm done.

Get the best that you can afford. Don't skimp on lighting or flow or a skimmer. Those three are my best friends in this hobby.

PS - I would go retro fit on your lighting and use 4 T5 bulbs and then put LED's in the middle. Nano Tuners is supposed to release the MR16 soon and that looks really cool. Much smaller than the PAR 38 and still packs a nice punch.

There are also some pretty nice LED strips you can buy on the market right now.

Just my thoughts for now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ahanix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 22 2010 at 1:27pm
Thanks for the input Ryan.


I think I have my wife talked into going with an open top tank, after doing some research on lighting, the only thing i could find is a 4 bulb TEK 24" fixture, but with my lighting being around 6 months out that will be the last thing I decide on, the skimmer will be picked up around Christmas time, so who knows what new thing will be out by that time.

My only issue with doing a corner overflow is that my tank will be in the center of my entry way, so it will be viewed from all sides (except the back) so I was trying to find a way to hide the overflow, but I also wanted to keep everything run through the bottom of my tank so I could push it as close as possible to the wall, so I guess back to the drawing board as far as that goes.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ahanix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 22 2010 at 10:10pm
So I finally made a wife approved stand mock-up, i'm pretty sure I know how I am going to build everything, including the piece to hang the light.

I need to do a bit more research, and the stand will look a lot more detailed than this, i'm still new to Google Sketchup, but this got me much more excited about starting on my stand.

Please critique this to your hearts extent, pictures of under the cabinet coming soon

Also, on the left side, there is another door for me to be able to slide the sump in and out if it ever springs a leak or anything, that or to install new hardware such as a new skimmer.etc

I'm not sure how I am going to do it yet, but i decided to also do a bottom drilled overflow in the back, this will make it so I can push the tank up against the wall / make a straight shot to the sump without PVC hanging out the back.

Also as you can see, I will make the tank sit down in the stand to cover up the bottom rim, this will also make it so I don't have to spend a lot on a nice surface to go under the tank







Edited by Ahanix - May 22 2010 at 10:12pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tcfab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 22 2010 at 11:28pm
looks good.Thumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ahanix Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 23 2010 at 1:06am
Heres the design for the sump area

Obviously the dimensions are a bit off, but I wanted to show how everything will look underneath the cabinet.  where the tank is, the pipes should be able to run directly down to the sump so the only PVC that will require a bend in it will be the return.

I put an area on the left hand side to put all of the electronics in, this is because my wall outlet will be right behind my tank in that area, so all I will need to do is cut a hole and plug everything in through there, i'll probably try to find a way to seal it in the back as well so water cant leak on the outlet by accident


From left to right I have the

Left:

Drain Tubing (trying to decide if I want to run two or three) 
Skimmer (Placed in the front for easy access to the Cup)

Middle:

Refugium

Right:

Heater and Return Pump


Also worth mentioning, there will be a door on the right side of the stand in case I need to remove the sump for any reason.




Edited by Ahanix - May 23 2010 at 1:08am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crzyfshguy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 23 2010 at 3:58am
Looks like a cool project!

As far as overflows go, Mike (fishoutofwater) built me an awesome one, so get with him and he can help you get what you want.
45G w/ leds
15G sump
MP10es












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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kellerexpress Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May 24 2010 at 4:31am
dude that looks great, cant wait to see it
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