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phys 
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 Posted: March 27 2011 at 9:27pm |
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I agree with you completely and i'm always one to ask what type of this and what is that for each thing i get.. i just usually forget to ask "how could it harm me?".
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bstuver
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Posted: March 27 2011 at 9:28pm |
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As true as that is sometimes new hobbiest have so much info to take in it can get overwhelming. I wear gloves most the time now but that would not have prevented my frogspawn from stinging me as it was down my arm.
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Jackie Stuver
"wait these aren't the happy Hawaiians oompa doompa godly heaven on your face zoas? I dont want them then. lol!" Ksmart
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ptronsp
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Posted: March 27 2011 at 9:45pm |
 dc wrote:
i agree with what you are saying but if you are a responsible reefer/hobbiest you should follow the golden rule. Research/Question and knowledge BEFORE you buy. i have no real pitty for hobbiest of this sort. i know it is hard to resist that sper-of-the moment purchase. but it also shows that you are not really concerned about the animals care needs. do you realize that most corals and fish are wild caught? meaning that if we do not try to keep them alive we are helping to destory our reefs. sorry if this seems harsh but it is a lesson we all need to keep in mind, i think. the info is out there the net, books, classes ect. its just taking the time to learn in my opion. sorry if you think im being rude. |
IMO when I go to buy a coral I am going to do research on that coral and believe me I do however, I have read plenty of articles on particular corals that is has never mentioned how it could harm you. By saying you are not concerned about about the care and needs of the animal is harsh to me because again when you read up on a lot of fish and or corals many of those same articles are not geared to addressing how they can harm you. I think most hobbyist want to gather and gain as much information as they can on reefing however, the amount of info out there is immense and we can not ever cover it all. What this thread is doing is trying to help people be aware of the dangers of the corals more so then anything. I consider myself very good at gathering as much info as I can about my corals but I have NEVER in my year of experience heard about the dangers of hammers. Zoas yes, Hammers no. Newbies can never know too much and if we can make it easier and have a thread on what is useful is awesome to me  . Pam
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lucyloo
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Posted: March 27 2011 at 10:04pm |
Where have you done your research? All the places I have read have given the riskes as well as the bennifits. You shouldnt be touching your coral without researching fragging first. All the fragging articles highly reccomend wearing gloves. Zoo 's will give you a rash but Paly s will put you in the hospital. When you go LFS ask about the dangers they will tell you. (If you dont ask they will assume you know)
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phys
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Posted: March 27 2011 at 10:36pm |
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Shouldnt it always be a safer assumption that everybody knows nothing?
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ptronsp
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Posted: March 27 2011 at 10:43pm |
phys wrote:
Shouldnt it always be a safer assumption that everybody knows nothing? |
I 100% agree  Pam
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bfessler
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Posted: March 27 2011 at 10:58pm |
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When I first got into the hobby I did research on my corals and worried about when I started fragging if I would get an infection or sick. Turns our I am not very sensitive and have handled most types including Zoanthids and Palys without gloves and even with fairly fresh cuts on my hands without incident. I do wear glasses when fragging though especially when using the dremel and I would recommend everyone be cautious when handling poisonous livestock.
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Burt An equal opportunity reefer, I support all hobbyists and organizations involved in Marine Aquarium Keeping. [email protected]
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dc
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Posted: March 27 2011 at 11:02pm |
that is true. but how would you feel if you went to buy a dog and they said Oh, it may bite.
What i am saying is education is key, they are animals. what animal can you think of that will not defend itself? ask! as far as reef creatures, they are all pretty nasty in one way or another they live in a place that is overcrowded more than any place on earth. check out coral warfare, sea cucumbers and apples, blennies(fang), rabbitfish(foxface), squirrelfish(solderfish),boxfish(cowfish) and one or two tangs. just some of the better know ones. also they are still finding more and more info everyday.
this is not to scare you if you respect them you should have no problems.
they main thing is dont blame someone else for your lack of knowledge and not asking.
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lucyloo
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Posted: March 27 2011 at 11:12pm |
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I agree with dc, I would be insulted if someone knocked my knowledge of what I was investing my money into. I wouldnt buy a car without being fully knowledgable about what I was getting into. However if you dont know just ask. I would also look in The Tropical Fish Hobbiest Magzine or Live Aquria for information.
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phys
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Posted: March 28 2011 at 2:35am |
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I'm unsure as to why you would be insulted by someone who doesnt know you, telling you about the hazards of something before you buy it. Had you gone in and said, yes, i would like to purchase this fairly toxic animal and plan on doing this or that and they still say," you know its toxic, right?", then you may have grounds to be insulted. It's just strange that people get insulted when somebody tells them something to help them out. In the case of a dog, you'd be surprised, you can tell someone a dog will bite them if they do something, and they do it, and get bit. Had you not told them, then i'd be more your fault than theirs. It's a liability for them not to tell you and really, if they're selling something toxic, then they should be 100% knowing that the people their selling to know the hazards. I, personally, would have been grateful had the persons I purchased my zoos from had told me they were hazardous before I (yes, i did) handled them without gloves.
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phys
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Posted: March 28 2011 at 2:37am |
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"Had you not told them, then i'd be more your fault than theirs" == "had you not told them, then it'd be more your fault than theirs"
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dc
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Posted: March 28 2011 at 3:56pm |
over all most of the problems come from fragging, scrapping them off rocks ect. except in the case of euphillias (hammers,frogspawn and torch) they are a bit more touchy a scrape on the arm can become very ichy, red, rashes ect. depending on the person. i have yet to hear of any of these things killing someone. Yes even lionfish there is NOT one documented case of someone dieing from the sting, there are some cases of dieing from infection.
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dc
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Posted: March 28 2011 at 3:59pm |
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what i am saying is becareful if you plan to frag ect. ask someone who knows. if you are at a LFS and they dont help you or dont know, dont shop there.
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ptronsp
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Posted: March 28 2011 at 4:34pm |
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When I first went into the hobby I went in with the mind set I was buying this coral so I could feed it nurture it and watch it flourish in my tank. As a newbie I not once thought about how one day I may want to frag it and what the dangers would be then. I am sure my husband thought it right from the beginning, I did not so maybe that is why I may not have brushed myself up like I should have when it came to the dangers.
That being said I knew what I was buying and knew what the requirements were going to be as far as taking care of the particular animal and the precautions to use but, didn't do my research on the dangers of fragging. That is why I think this is an important thread.
Pam
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dc
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Posted: March 28 2011 at 9:30pm |
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i agree that this is an important thread. i just dont agree with the above statements that it is up to someone else. unless you pay someone to mantain your tank or to do some fragging for you.
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CapnMorgan
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Posted: March 28 2011 at 9:38pm |
Here is my thoughts on the matter:
Yes palys and zoas are toxic. Can they make you sick? Sure. Is it worth knowing and taking precautions? Definitely. But as it's been said most new hobbyists don't know that corals can be toxic, and to be honest most people experience no ill effects from them. If you look at sites like liveaquaria.com which is probably the largest online source of corals and fish; zoanthids and palythoas are not listed as venomous or toxic. I myself frag corals all the time without gloves or glasses unless I'm using the saw or dremel. The real bottom line is that we as hobbyists should help educate each other, keeping in mind that what works for one person may not always be right or work for someone else. As I said in the other thread regarding frogspawn stings, different people react to different corals. I have only experienced ill effects from a handful of things, and they were more unpleasant and annoying than anything. I guess what I'm saying is read up, ask your friends, and then take whatever precautions are necessary for your situation.
Edited by CapnMorgan - March 28 2011 at 10:57pm
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Steve My Old 180G Mixed ReefCurrently: 120G Wavefront Mixed 29G Seahorse & Softies Running ReefAngel Plus x2 435-8
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jmw
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Posted: March 28 2011 at 9:44pm |
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I've bought quite a bit of coral from the LFS (although not very local to me). I alway's asked about care and compatibility with things in my tank. I never thought to ask about how toxic it could be nor was the information ever offered. It's just something that is easily overlooked. I've handled, moved and fragged my coral without any effects so I must not be to sensitive. However I moved a rock one time and got stung by a bristle worm, dang that hurt for a week! Very good thread.
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lucyloo
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Posted: March 28 2011 at 10:55pm |
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It s good to hear some understanding. I m not saying that they will kill you, but it is important to get all the facts. I think sometimes it is forgotten that these are comming from the wild and have a different way of protecting themselves from preditors.
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Mark Peterson
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Posted: March 29 2011 at 10:38am |
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I'm surprised that, unless I missed it, nowhere in this thread has there been mention of how to deal with the stings/pokes/injuries. Should we discuss it here?
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Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9244 Pay it forward - become a paid WMAS member 
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Summertop
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Posted: March 29 2011 at 10:50am |
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I wonder if we can convince "BuilderOfDreams" to be "GiverOfPresentation" at one of our meetings...I was there when we had the Toxicology meeting. but if BuilderOfDreams is doing some research, we could sure do another meeting (it has been quite a while).
What say you?
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Shawn Winterbottom
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