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Sick baby clowns?

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Jeffatpm View Drop Down
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    Posted: January 21 2012 at 10:53am
With Pam's help I've got babies alive and kicking. I had maroon and perc in the larva in the same tank, the maroon have almost all died and last night I'm looking at the percs and see white spots on them I'm thinking a fungus ror something. Take a look at the pics and zoom in to see it,
Let me know if you have any thoughts.

http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy220/Jeffatpm/2012-01-20_23-21-07_394.jpg


http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy220/Jeffatpm/2012-01-20_23-21-04_662.jpg


http://i793.photobucket.com/albums/yy220/Jeffatpm/2012-01-20_23-19-35_267.jpg
210 Reef with loads of LEDS
Located Near 4800 W and 3700 S in West Valley.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ptronsp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2012 at 5:01pm
I responded to your PM... any info from others would be GREAT! I have very little experience with this problem.
Pam


The only clowns I like are in my tank!



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Mark Peterson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2012 at 5:30pm
It could also be Ich. Have you added a tiny amount of GO to the tank?
Please show pics of the entire setup and describe the filtration and known water parameters.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ptronsp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2012 at 6:14pm
I agree Mark. That is what I sent in my PM to him.. I am leaning towards ich.
Pam


The only clowns I like are in my tank!



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeffatpm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 21 2012 at 10:01pm
It could also be Ich. Have you added a tiny amount of GO to the tank?
 ---- Mark What is GO?
I'll get some pics on tonight or tomorrow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeffatpm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 22 2012 at 7:29am
I have the tank at 78 regular salinity.  I add nanochlropsis periodically to keep the rotifers hatching, just enought to make a light green.  I vacuum out the bottom every couple days,  about once a week I do a water change of at least 25% with water from the parent tank(the 120 gal sitting next to it)
 
 
I have an air bubbler, a clay pot, snails, a ball of cheato, and a heater.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2012 at 10:07am
I can't remember if you were able to come see the Nemos in their Clownfish Nursery before we left. It was different than what you have set up. I'll post some pics below.

Have you added a small amount of GO (Garlic Oil) to this tank?

What I see in the pics and description is a need for more biofiltration in the babies tank.
You said, "...add nanochlropsis periodically to keep the rotifers hatching, just enought to make a light green."
Is this live algae or algae paste? If it's paste, then there is an even greater need for adequate biofiltration.

Have you checked the N levels prior to a water change? What were the readings, especially Ammonia and Nitrite?

You said, "...vacuum out the bottom every couple days,  about once a week I do a water change of at least 25% with water from the parent tank"
How much water is removed in the vacuuming and is it also replaced with water from the parent tank? If so, that's a lot of old tank water being used for water changes. That old water from the 120 also has the Ich parasite in it. I believe it would be better to use recently mixed saltwater that has aerated for 4 hours than to use water from the parents tank. But I have an even better idea for you. Smile

I said above that I would post some pics of the Clownfish Nursery. Also, here is a link to the thread I started back then. http://utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=48272

My thinking was that if Clownfish grow up in the ocean in conditions similar to where they live out their lives, why not set up a system that filters the water the same as where the parents live out their lives. So the filtration is done by a natural refugium (not RDP) and the juvenile fish grow up in that Refugium with LS,LR and a lot of algae.
The powerhead, visible in the first pic, is valved down to move a couple gals per hour from the Juvenile/Refugium tank on the left into the Larvae tank on the right. A fabric filter keeps larvae from going up the U tube siphon back to the Refugium.
The Larvae tank is filtered by the Juvenile/Refugium tank. Most of the Aeration/circulation for the Larvae tank was a bubble wand set at one end of the 10 gal tank. The bubble rate was adjusted to provide good circulation without throwing the larvae around too fast.
Ordinary 10% monthly water changes included vacuuming accumulations of crud off the Larvae tank bottom. Rotifers were grown in the bottom tank using Algae Paste aerated/circulated with an air stone. Growing Rotifers in the Nemo's system was too polluting and could not keep up with the demand of juveniles and larvae.
It worked perfectly.Big smile





Edited by Mark Peterson - January 24 2012 at 10:18am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeffatpm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 24 2012 at 2:14pm
I like the idea now that you've explained more about the setup Mark.  I did put riced garlic in the baby tank a couple days ago.  I think I'm going to move them into the bigger tank at this point which would consist of putting them in a acrylic box with wedding veil over the holes.  I think this will keep them healthy with more water to disperse waste and other things.
The tank has lots of macro and I think I'll put some sand in the bottom to provide a base.  

I think now that they are big enough this should be ok, my only concern is making sure they are fed often, because with the wedding veil they won't have constant food lying about. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 25 2012 at 12:04pm
I wouldn't do that. The change will be more likely to kill the babies, and keeping tiny fish in a clear container in the open water is very stressful. They will be constantly frightened out of their wits by the big fish coming close to eat them.Dead

You didn't answer these questions.
QuestionIs this live algae or algae paste? If it's paste, then there is an even greater need for adequate biofiltration.
QuestionHave you checked the N levels prior to a water change? What were the readings, especially Ammonia and Nitrite?

And more.
Raw garlic, not processed garlic oil? Is that how you give garlic to your adult fish?
Did the Ich leave the babies yet?

If it were me, I'd improve filtration on the tank as it is:
- More types of macroalgae, like Caulerpa and also extend the photoperiod.
- The bubbler is hardly going. Can you increase the air? This will give it more flow.
- Notice in the pic of the Refugium tank, the external filter? This was mostly for circulation and also where I ran 2+ weeks per month of AC, a necessity for all reef tanks and especially useful for baby Clownfish. Be sure to rinse it well to remove carbon dust.
- If there is a small piece of LR in the parent tank, a piece from higher up, not on the sand where it's more likely to bring in more Ich as trophants in the sand.

Speaking of sand, for me, sand in the Larvae tank grew worms which extended from the sand to catch and eat the larvae. This is why there are two tanks. A bare bottom tank is better for larvae, just like the open water of the ocean where the larvae survive. Rock and sand surfaces are where coral and other inverts catch and eat larvae. A week or so after Metamorphosis, the baby Nemos were moved over to the Refugium tank.


Edited by Mark Peterson - January 25 2012 at 12:13pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeffatpm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 25 2012 at 12:31pm
Sorry yeah I did miss those - I use algea paste - nanochlropsis from BSD.
I checked Amonia yesterday 2.5PPM :-|.

There aren't any fish where they were at in the big tank, and yeah what I tried didn't work - I put em back in the other tank.

I do use raw garlic in the big tanks as well and it clears the ick off the tangs quite well.  The babies ich seems to be getting better.

I think I do need to add rock sand and other things to the larva tank when the larva are big enough - I have the bubbler going full blast.

What about putting lots of macro in the tank when they larva are just starting out?

As Always Thank You!
Kevin
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