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Marine Velvet

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    Posted: April 20 2013 at 2:11pm
So recently I lost an emperor angelfish to marine velvet, and I have now lost two anthias and a copperband as well. The remaining fish seem fine, but I'm worried nonetheless. I can't catch them without completely destroying my rockwork, so doing a freshwater dip treatment is almost out of the question. I feed with garlic, and try to maintain a stress-free environment for the fish. Is there anything more I can do?

I have these left...
2 Oscellaris Clownfish
1 Dispar Anthias
1 Powder Blue Tang
1 Niger Triggerfish
1 Melanurus Wrasse
1 Yellow Rose Goby

Should I be worried about the fish and what more can I do for them?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chuckfu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2013 at 2:27pm
Be worried! It wipped out my tank once and all that survived was a damsel. Is it killing them one by one? It was horrible watching my clowns go. Good luck.
Try, try, try, then give up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ann_A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2013 at 2:30pm
Originally posted by chuckfu chuckfu wrote:

Be worried! It wipped out my tank once and all that survived was a damsel. Is it killing them one by one? It was horrible watching my clowns go. Good luck.

Yes so far it has been one by one. Cry
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chuckfu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2013 at 2:42pm
Thats how it was in my tank except for the clownfish. It was horrible watching them die. It was like skin was falling off of them.
Try, try, try, then give up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ann_A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2013 at 3:05pm
Is there anything I can do for my fish???  Cry
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sabeypets Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2013 at 3:09pm
UV sterilizer.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ann_A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2013 at 3:15pm
Already have one
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chuckfu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2013 at 3:22pm
What I read it said copper is the only thing effective.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bryce Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2013 at 5:03pm
Can you do a larger partial water change so that the fish have less swim room/ places to hide in the rock work to catch them and dip or quarantine? that or fish trap.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ReefdUp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2013 at 5:29pm
As having fought it and beat it...you can't beat it halfway. You have to wipe it out. Qt tank...that's why I keep stressing them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote chuckfu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2013 at 5:58pm
Where did u get the angel from?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ann_A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 20 2013 at 5:59pm
Originally posted by chuckfu chuckfu wrote:

Where did u get the angel from?

Pet Village.

Assuming I'm able to catch the fish, what method of treatment is best in the quarantine tank?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ann_A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 21 2013 at 9:09am
Alright I'm going to move the fish into quarantine this week. Here's my treatment plan... Let me know what you think.

Day 1:
-Perform a 10 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue. Move fish directly into quarantine tank with copper.

Day 2:
-Perform a 100% water change on quarantine tank meanwhile doing a 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue. Move fish back into quarantine tank with copper.

Day 3:
-Perform a 100% water change on quarantine tank meanwhile doing a 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue. Move fish back into quarantine tank with copper.

Day 5:
-Perform a 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue.

Day 7:
-Perform a 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue.

Day 10:
-Perform a 100% water change on quarantine tank meanwhile doing a 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue. Move fish back into quarantine tank with copper.

Day 17:
-Perform a 100% water change on quarantine tank meanwhile doing a 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue. Move fish back into quarantine tank with copper.

Day 24:
-Perform a 100% water change on quarantine tank meanwhile doing a 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue. Move fish back into quarantine tank with copper.

Day 31:
-Perform a 100% water change on quarantine tank meanwhile doing a 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue. Move fish back into quarantine tank WITHOUT copper.

Day 45:
-Perform a 50% water change on quarantine tank.

Day 59:
-Move fish back to display tank (assuming treatment has gone well and no fish are showing signs of MV).

Edited by Ann_A - April 21 2013 at 9:33am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ann_A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 21 2013 at 9:35am
Just updated the treatment plan after doing some more research on MV and finding out the full life cycle and lifetime expectancy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ReefdUp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 21 2013 at 9:43am
Hey Ann...this is what I'd suggest based on our earlier discussions:

Day 1: 5 minute freshwater dip in methylene blue, then into a tank with copper.

Day 2: 5 minute freshwater dip in methylene blue, then back into the same tank with copper (No 100% water change. The copper will handle any dislodged parasites. I think the water change would be too much stress, and it'll use more copper.)

Day 3: 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue, then back into the same tank with copper.

Day 4-21: Copper treatment

I still don't like copper for this parasite since it has such a small range of effectiveness. I'd rather see you do the tank transfer method with freshwater dips between rather than returning the fish to an infectious tank. Also, I wouldn't do more than 3 freshwater dips since they are rather stressful. The initial 3 will knock off the vast majority (if not all) the trophonts so that the fish can begin to heal. This is where I like to run an antibiotic (but I don't think most are compatible with copper.) The copper will hopefully keep the fish from getting reinfected if it is kept at the proper dosage (hope you have a copper test kit.)

Copper only targets the dinospores (the free-swimming stage).
Freshwater dips target the trophonts (the attached-to-the-fish stage).
Tank transfers target the dinospores and tomonts (reproductive stage).

Tomonts are pretty much entirely drug-treatment-resistant. That's why I like the tank transfers in combination with freshwater dips for this parasite.

Last note...I decreased the time on the first freshwater dip to 5 minutes. Looking back through my notes, I don't think 10 minutes is necessary.
   

Edited by ReefdUp - April 21 2013 at 9:44am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ReefdUp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 21 2013 at 9:50am
P.S. Chloroquine diphosphate supposedly works wonders on this...and only requires one to two doses over 10 days. I have some...but I've never used it. If you want to try it, you're welcome to...but I can't be of much help.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ReefdUp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 21 2013 at 9:56am
Here are some good articles...

This one is just a summary of the disease and options...but it's kinda old (2004.)
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-07/sp/feature/

This one is more up-to-date and helpful (IMO):
https://srac.tamu.edu/index.cfm/event/getFactSheet/whichfactsheet/227/
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ann_A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 21 2013 at 10:01am
Adjusted the treatment plan:


Day 1:
-Perform a 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue. Move fish directly into quarantine tank with copper.

Day 2:
-Perform a 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue. Move fish back into quarantine tank with copper.

Day 3:
-Perform a 5 minute freshwater dip with methylene blue. Move fish back into quarantine tank with copper.

Day 4-58:
-Quarantine tank with copper treatment.

Day 59:
-Move fish back to display tank (assuming treatment has gone well and no fish are showing signs of MV).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ReefdUp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 21 2013 at 10:08am
Sent you a text. No need to go to Day 58 with copper (in fact, that can cause serious health issues in fish.) The freshwater dips will knock out nearly 100% of the velvet parasite, which will shorten your required treatment time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ann_A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 21 2013 at 10:15am
Ok I'm going to switch from copper to non-medicated saltwater on day 25.
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