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dougandtito
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Topic: Is this aptasia? Posted: January 10 2015 at 10:05am |
This has recently shown up in our new tank (still going through first cycle). Is it aptasia, and if so, what should we do about it?
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rfoote
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 10:16am |
Yep! Peppermint shrimp, Berghia nudibranchs are known to eat them. You can also inject it with some kalkwasser or hydrogen peroxide, and it should kill it.
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dougandtito
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 10:21am |
We're about a month-and-a-half into our first cycle. No ammonia spike yet... Is it too early to put something like a peppermint shrimp in there? And since we only have one or two very small little aptasia (polyps?), if we put something live in there to eat the aptasia, would it die after the aptasia was gone? Or would something like a peppermint shrimp be able to survive on other nutrients in the tank as well? And would it be able to weather the cycle once we do get our ammonia/nitrite/nitrate spikes?
The other alternatives—"injecting" it—sound sort of hard (or maybe just need to be explained to me). How do you inject it? Like, with a shot needle? And what is kalwasser?
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Bryce
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 10:23am |
If that is the only one, which is almost never the case, and if you can remove that rock or get a pair of wire cutters or tin snips to it, snip/cut/break that little portion of the rock off, most other methods will leave some form of life behind and soon more will pop up....I have had success with pepperment shrimp when added in groups of 3 to 4 as far as would they live based on your cycle I am not sure of your parameters and im not sure what you mean by a ammonia spike unless you plan on adding ammonia, what you should be looking for is a nitrite spike followed by a nitrate spike and then when you can add ammonia to 2 or 3ppm and it can be removed by your system in 24 hours (ie nitrite and ammonia are zero) your tank is completing the nitrogen cycle fast enough for fish...you will want to then focus on nitrate removal before you add coral
Edited by Bryce - January 10 2015 at 10:31am
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dougandtito
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 10:37am |
I'm not adding ammonia, just a deli shrimp and fish food. I thought that the decay of those would cause ammonia to go up, which would then transition to a nitrite spike, and then a nitrate spike. For weeks, we've been sitting at 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, and about 20 ppm nitrate.
So if I'm not planning to add ammonia, would three or four peppermint shrimp do OK in my tank at this point?
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Reefer4Ever
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 10:46am |
Just my .02 here, if you're at 0 ammonia and 0 nitrite with 20 nitrate I'm going to say you missed the ammonia and nitrite spikes along the way. Water changes will export the nitrate and or some macro algae. I belive you have completed the cycle. I would ask others to weigh in on this as well. Nitrate is what happens after ammonia and is converted to nitrite and then nitrite converted to nitrate. Again just my .02 worth. Aptasia I would try and either chip a part of the rock off or something as they can take over a reef which leads to unhappy aquarist.
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Bryce
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 10:46am |
Its sounds cycled to me then if what you say is true, yes you should be fine with the pepperment, there is no guarantee they will eat it and eat it so completely it doesnt come back. If it were me and the option at all existed to removed the rock and break the tiny areas where it is thats what i would do...peps are more the option in an established reef with coral where pulling the rock out isnt an option....at the end of the day though if u look very hard I am almost certain you have more than just 2 aptasia which is why I said if your pretty sure its really just 2 of them just be 100% and snip the rock.
Edited by Bryce - January 10 2015 at 10:53am
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dougandtito
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 11:00am |
Haha, omg, two weeks ago ago after first getting these readings I posted (http://utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=74176&KW=20+ppm&PID=580325&title=end-of-our-cycle#580325) asking if I was correct in assuming that we had completed our cycle, and the consensus was that, without having seen diatoms (still haven't), we had not completed our cycle and the problem was a lack of bioload. So we started feeding the crap out of the tank with fish food, and there's a rotting deli shrimp in there as we speak. Still, the readings sit at 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, and 20 nitrate.
I'm pushing for snipping the rock--we really only have seen one, and my fiance stares at that tank all day--but he's pretty stubborn and wants to go the peppermint shrimp route. We just had a little argument about it. :) He really doesn't want to snip the rock, and he's convinced from what he's read on other forums and websites that a few peppermint shrimp is the way to go. So if I let him get his way, do we need to do water changes or anything first, or just go ahead and get a few peps and see how it goes?
Also, Reefer4Ever, can you clarify for me a little what you're saying about water changes at this point? We should do one before adding new livestock, because we want to get nitrates back down to 0 as well, and get rid of macroalgae (of which we have some, but not a ton)?
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Bryce
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 11:06am |
If u seriously have a rotting shrimp and zero ammonia I might question the ammonia test results, peps are more to control aptasia not elminate, I have no visible aptasia in my tank for over a year since adding peps but guess what vthey are in my over flow, in my return chamber where peps cant get to....think of it like an opportunity to ELIMINATE the pest vs maintain the pest.
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Molli
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 11:08am |
I would go the injectable route with aptasia. If you touch it you will noticed that it will completely retract into a little hole. You need to completely cover that hole -- that chokes it out and it dies. You can even use super glue. Keep up with aptasia and you won't have a problem. So far in my 90 G tank I have only found 2 aptasia.
Not all varieties of peppermint shrimp will eat aptasia. You could end up purchasing the wrong kind -- although shrimp are fun to watch even if they don't eat what you want them to eat.
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Bryce
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 11:16am |
Kalk paste will work but why mess with that and there is a good chance some live and guess what read up on aptasia when threatened or disturbed they can release more elements of life into the water column and the problem gets exponentially worse, you can be successful as Molli was but think of it as a cancer....what route would take? "Aiptasia can reproduce both sexually and asexually. Asexual reproduction occur when a small segment is separated from the pedal disk. A single cell can be enough for a new Aiptasia anemone to form. The separated segment will start growing and develop a new polyp." Rock will break surprisingly very easy,were not talking a lot of effort, wire cutters are my go to, most of the time I don't even pull the rock just wire cutters straight in tank, great for fragging, I have a dedicated tank pair.
Edited by Bryce - January 10 2015 at 11:28am
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Reefer4Ever
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 11:37am |
Water changes are done to export nutrients that are not needed (nitrate and phosphate). You will probably never get nitrate down to zero but a lot of in habitants like a little nitrate. Keep the macro algae growing as it use both nitrates and phosphates to thrive. I would find another ammonia test and if the reading is 0 I would safely say your cycle is complete. I'm am thinking that you are going to find out its time for a fish and I would add fish slowly to let the system get used to the new bio load.
Edited by Reefer4Ever - January 10 2015 at 11:38am
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dougandtito
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 11:47am |
Thanks for all this advice, everyone. I really hope I can convince him
to just break off the rock and get rid of that stuff altogether. In the
meantime, I'll bring my water in to a fish store and ask them to run a
test on it--I have also had my doubts about the strips I am testing
with, as there has been no change in any levels in the two weeks I've
been testing. The deli shrimp has only been in there for two or three
days--does that help explain why there's no ammonia, or should it still
be there?
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dougandtito
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 11:49am |
So my natural next question is going to be: What is your favorite choice
for a first fish to add to a newly cycled tank? What's the best in
terms of being hardy/a good tank-breaker-inner/relatively easy for
first-time aquarists?
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badfinger
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 12:00pm |
How big is that? Hard to tell from the pic size. But maybe it could be a form of hydroids if its small enough. Just curious. It does look like aptasia also though
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Reefer4Ever
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 12:01pm |
This is a better question, what does your fish list have on it as that would make it easier to know what to add. I am very curious with the water tests at the lfs. I have never had much luck with strips and matching the color is just a best guess. They can give you some info in a pinch but I would look into get a reef kit, salifert, red sea something along those lines and opinions vary drastically. I shall be awaiting post from water test at lfs
Edited by Reefer4Ever - January 10 2015 at 12:02pm
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Bryce
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 12:02pm |
Chromis, 2 or 3 of them, if you have a shrimp in there decaying unless this is a huge system or very mature I would think you would read ammonia, buy a test kit don't waste money on having water tested, an api test kit is all you need if you are serious about the hobby you will need one so don't flush money down drain on a lfs test especially for ammonia
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dougandtito
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 12:08pm |
Badfinger, it's VERY tiny, probably just a few centimeters. I'm terrible at estimating length, but it can't be more than a quarter-inch.
How do these other test kits work (API, etc.)? Not color-based? Because I hate trying to read those color strips. My fiance is good at distinguishing colors, but I'm TERRIBLE at it. I once wore a brown belt for years before finding out it was actually black. :)
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Bryce
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 12:11pm |
That is aptasia I stake my life on it no question. Api is water drops then color but its easy to read.
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Reefer4Ever
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Posted: January 10 2015 at 12:16pm |
Once you're done with the cycle you will rarely if ever test for ammonia and nitrite again as I don't test either of those at all now. Don't go crazy spending much money on tests for ammonia and nitrite as you will be moving in the direction of testing other parameters (calc, alk, mag, phosphates, nitrates).
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