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Alternative LED Heatsink options

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    Posted: April 10 2012 at 12:49pm
I am working on putting together a parts list for my DIY LED build. I am trying to find heatsink alternatives.

I know lots of people use T or C channel from Home depot, but I worry about overheating, and I don't want to run a lot of fans.

I was perusing everything "aluminum" at Lowes and came across these:



What do you guys think? It's pretty cheap, just about the same price as the aluminum channel.

Edited by ssilcox - April 10 2012 at 12:49pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote phys Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2012 at 12:52am
how thick is it? i have 1/8 inch thick aluminum heat sink i stole from an old car amp on mine but i run fans to cool extra. its also a higher grade aluminum than what you may have there. Denser aluminum will suck heat better than cheaper grades so if the HD is a better grade, it'll cool better.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Enthalpy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2012 at 8:48am

Also more surface area the better. That way you allow enough heat transfer with any natural convection you may have by not using fans.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ssilcox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2012 at 9:27am
Good points. I'll check. I am guessing 1/16th, but it may be 1/8. I starting thinking about this last night too - I am going to have $600 in LED's, not sure I want to scrimp on the device that will keep them running for a long and healthy life...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Laird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2012 at 9:35am
Do you have a link to that?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ssilcox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2012 at 9:40am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote phys Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2012 at 11:55am
just remember surface are increases with larger and more fins.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rufessor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2012 at 1:41pm
To be honest, I think your not really making a lot of sense in terms of the build.  If you really are purchasing 600 dollars worth of LEDs it would, IMHO- be a major mistake to even think about the items your contemplating.

3 good reasons.

(1)
You new shiny LED's presumably are start mounted -  Thus they REQUIRE a perfectly (I.E. CNC machined would be nice) surface to mount to, ANY air/debris in the interface between the LED star base and the heat sink will severely limit your ability to suck heat away from the actual LED die which is mounted to the star.

Those items have not a flat surface in sight.

(2)
Those items appear to have plastic all over the place, inside, outside etc.  Plastic is a very nice insulator...

(3)
I have something like 28 LEDs mounted to a 11x7 heat sink with CNC machined Fins that have grooves in them, I have them mounted in a canopy that is completely exposed to air beneath the lights (i.e. is suspended over the top of the tank with a very large space between the tank and the canopy).  Even running at 40% power I was getting too HOT.  I installed two variable speed fans and drilled a bunch of holes in the top of the canopy to promote breathing and now am FINE... but thats with almost 100 bucks in heat sinks (they are even black anodized to increase radiant heat transfer) and another 50 in fans.

(4)- bonus reason-
You will be replacing 600 worth of LEDs if you don't pay careful attention to their temperature.  

It is NOT worth playing around with heat sinks.  I know that LOTS of people have them mounted to aluminum channel and they seem fine but everyone is using fans so far as I can tell and they are using a dispersed array design with the LEDs distributed over the entire tank so there is a good bit of space between them... if you go that route or similar for heat sink remember this fact when mounting your stars and you should be OK but get FANS.

The U channel at least that provides a suitable mounting surface- again- seriously advise against items you show in pictures... they look like door jambs. 

One other thing to think of.  Part of my cooling issue is that my design has the LEDS clustered as CLOSE as I could mount them into "spot light" or PAR groups, without the stars quite touching.  Each group is about 14 LEDs in less than 10 sq inches of space on the heat sink.  Most general guide lines call for between 2-3 sq inches of heat sink per LED and thats in a dispersed array with a standard aluminum heat sink with the fins etc... 

so my build is fairly a-typical and this is causing me MUCH more heat dissipation issues than a dispersed array would pose... so remember this when thinking about my comments/experience/opinion, I am probably more concerned with this than others have experienced given the power density I have.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ssilcox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2012 at 2:25pm
Originally posted by rufessor rufessor wrote:


(1)
You new shiny LED's presumably are start mounted -  Thus they REQUIRE a perfectly (I.E. CNC machined would be nice) surface to mount to, ANY air/debris in the interface between the LED star base and the heat sink will severely limit your ability to suck heat away from the actual LED die which is mounted to the star.



The pic above is a little misleading. Here is another one of them with the center rubber portion removed. The area in the center of it is flat.


Originally posted by rufessor rufessor wrote:


Those items appear to have plastic all over the place, inside, outside etc.  Plastic is a very nice insulator...



Plastic/rubber components will be removed. There is no need for them.

Originally posted by rufessor rufessor wrote:


(3)
I have something like 28 LEDs mounted to a 11x7 heat sink with CNC machined Fins that have grooves in them, I have them mounted in a canopy that is completely exposed to air beneath the lights (i.e. is suspended over the top of the tank with a very large space between the tank and the canopy).  Even running at 40% power I was getting too HOT.  I installed two variable speed fans and drilled a bunch of holes in the top of the canopy to promote breathing and now am FINE... but thats with almost 100 bucks in heat sinks (they are even black anodized to increase radiant heat transfer) and another 50 in fans.



I'll have decent spacing in between them, and fans either way I decide to go.

My thought is that these are significantly better than the U channel that people are using. Just as cheap, but with more surface area.

Originally posted by rufessor rufessor wrote:


they look like door jambs. 


:) They are!

All that being said, for the reasons you pointed out, I am still trying to decide if I will try them out or not. If people are having great success with U channel - if this material provides significantly more surface area, wouldnt this at least be preferable to U channel?

Edited by ssilcox - April 11 2012 at 2:29pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Laird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2012 at 2:33pm
Its actually looks really similar to what these guys use.

http://www.reeflight.com/

You can buy those at bird world, fyi.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rufessor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2012 at 3:21pm
Cool... just wanted to give you my experience and quick thoughts.... if you read posts from people who are used to using heat sinks to cool things that really truly demand cooling, LEDs are actually pretty easy to keep cool... but they are kinda spend so I wanted to be sure you were aware of a few of the considerations that immediately came to mind reading your post.  Sounds like your on the right track... DIY is after all about doing it your own way.  I like doing new things and trying different ideas... maybe these will be OK after all if you can strip plastic, find a mount point, and hang them... you aught to be OK esp if you buy fans.

Cool.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ssilcox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 11 2012 at 3:25pm
Originally posted by rufessor rufessor wrote:

Cool.


No pun intended, right?

I definitely appreciate your experience and insight.
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