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Cynao kicking my ass

Printed From: Utah Reefs
Category: Help
Forum Name: General Help
Forum Description: The place to ask about pest, problems, hitchhikers, etc.
URL: http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=82781
Printed Date: December 10 2017 at 5:48pm


Topic: Cynao kicking my ass
Posted By: chuckfu5
Subject: Cynao kicking my ass
Date Posted: June 25 2017 at 3:48pm
This bacteria is driving me insane. A little background.

1. Tank has been running since January.
2. Tank is a Fluval Evo Marine edition.
3. Tank is stock with the addition of the Fluval PS 2 protein skimmer and a jebao TW-10 with the controller set on max and the Variable flow pattern.
Tank has consistently measured at
Nitrate 2
Phosphates .02
Calcium - 450 every 3rd day dosing.
Magnesium - 1400 dosing once a week
Alkalinity- 8.4 daily dosing.
Salinity - 1.025

Tank is heavily stocked with sps, lps and softies.
4 fish and I perform every other week 5 Gallons water changes religiously.
Tank was seeded with dead old rock.

No other type of algae but the cyano.

Any help is greatly appreciated.



Replies:
Posted By: kevin.st
Date Posted: June 25 2017 at 4:16pm
72 hour total blackout.  skim hard.


Posted By: Krazie4Acans
Date Posted: June 26 2017 at 7:49am
PO4 and Phosphate are the same thing but you list two numbers for it. I suspect that the .02 number is correct but I would hate to assume. I'm also guessing the 2 number if N03?

Cyano is a photosynthetic bacteria that needs light and food in order to be present. The solution that has worked best for me is reducing feeding, shortening the light cycle (or going black out for a couple days if it's really bad) and increasing flow within the display with more powerheads or increasing the speed of the powerheads already in the system. It's also important that you have good surface movement to allow for proper gas exchange at the surface.

If you have tried all of that without a good result then Chemiclean does work and will remove it from the system. It does require some additional work and a couple of days of closely monitoring the system ( as well as shutting off some of your filtration) but it does work and as long as it's done correctly is quite safe.

There is still the potential of it coming back with any of these methods as this tank is still relatively new and is still building it's bio filtration system.


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My ocean.
90g (yup, won it!), 40g, 28g, & 10g Systems
PADI Advanced Open Water
http://utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=63568&title=krazies-nano-paradise" rel="nofollow - Tank Thread:


Posted By: Mark Peterson
Date Posted: June 26 2017 at 10:19pm
Interested in burying the hatchet? We have had difficulties, but in the interest of promoting peace and friendship, I cannot see a problem, but that I simply must share what I can to help solve the problem.

I agree with Krazie4Acans. 
For me in this case, rather than re-invent the wheel, I'll refer to two recent forum discussions where excellent advice (hopefully) eliminated the Cyano for good.

http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=82630" rel="nofollow - http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=82630
http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=82539&KW=cyano&PID=624855&title=type-of-algae#624855" rel="nofollow - http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=82539&KW=cyano&PID=624855&title=type-of-algae#624855

Aloha,
Mark  Hug
808-345-1049 call/text anytime for reef advice


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Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:
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Posted By: Mark Peterson
Date Posted: June 28 2017 at 10:50am
Last night, Chuck and I exchanged quite a number of texts and he sent me some tank pics. It was fun to work through it. Smile

After thinking about it overnight, I thought I might share the things that seemed to me to be contributing to the Cyano. I am extremely analytical, maybe even obsessive-compulsive about details. Analyzing the details is like hunting deer with a powerful rifle rather than a shotgun. I've been solving reef tank issues this way for over 20 years. This makes me very confident but also tends to make my written advice come across as kind of arrogant. In person I'm not so arrogant in person. Wink

1.   "Tank has been running since January." 
That's a young tank, still growing it's biofiltration. Cyano starts when the bioload exceeds the biofiltration.

 2.  "Tank is [only 13 gal and] is heavily stocked with sps, lps and softies [and] 4 fish." 
In my opinion the tank is not mature enough to be so heavily stocked. Though I always say that fish pollute the water while coral filter the water, coral do create waste and put off a slime that requires processing by the biofiltration. Skimming helps but biofiltration is more powerful than commonly understood. In other words, even where there is a skimmer, a lack of sufficient biofiltration can lead to these kind of problems, because a lot of waste does not get handled by protein skimming.

3.   " ...every other week 5 Gallons water changes religiously." 
Unfortunately, water changes provide nutrients for algae growth. My usual advice when there is a nuisance algae problem is to suspend frequent/large water changes and stick to the standard 10% monthly water changes.

 4.  "Tank was seeded with dead old rock."
As many have discovered, LR has a plethora of animals living right to the core. When they die, it can take up to a year for the pollution, including heavy metals to seep out of the rock as it recovers. Chuck had already started using my best advice, placing a pad of Poly-Bio-Marine's Poly Filter in the system to deal with the pollution coming out of the rock. Thumbs Up

 5.  "No other type of [nuisance] algae but the cyano." There is a small ball of Chaeto and spots of Coralline Algae growing in the tank. My suggestion is to add more Chaeto and even some Caulerpa. Each algae removes specific combinations of pollution. Any algae that is eating pollution competes with the Cyano for nutrients. A young tank without sufficient other biofiltration can benefit from macroalgae growth left in the system for many months or maybe years. That's why Refugiums are so useful. 

6.   Final point. The pics show a 100% Oolitic sand bed with practically nothing in the way of worms and bugs. One of the advantages of larger sand and rubble is its ability to harbor worms and bugs. The setup method described in the Reefkeeping Tips thread linked below suggests using a ~1/2" layer of Oolitic sand with ~1" layer of larger particle sand on top. Bugs and worms do an important job in the biofiltration process. It could really help to add an infusion of those micro-animals by adding some LS and perhaps some LR from a well established, mature reef aquarium.

Hope this helps.
Aloha,
Mark  Hug


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Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:
www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9244
Pay it forward - become a paid WMAS member


Posted By: Adam Blundell
Date Posted: June 28 2017 at 6:44pm
Probably all good advice. Glad you were available to help.

Adam

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Next Meeting: Holiday Social


Posted By: chuckfu5
Date Posted: June 28 2017 at 6:58pm
Thanks for the advice last night Mark.


Posted By: Mark Peterson
Date Posted: June 29 2017 at 12:03pm
Glad to try to help.
Please come back later with an update on what's working.
Aloha


-------------
Reefkeeping Tips, & quick, easy setup tricks:
www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9244
Pay it forward - become a paid WMAS member



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