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Need help with water chemistry

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bigfishtoo View Drop Down
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    Posted: February 08 2011 at 4:25pm
Hello, need some advice on my system, I have 120 gallon main tank with two overflows and one return and a 40 gallon sump with some caulerpa. I have two 175watt and 4 110 vho lighting, the 175 are 14,000k and vho 2 are actinic & 2 are 10000k. Have large skimmer in sump and a quiet one 4000 pump for return to main tank. Have two koralia pumps inside one on each side of tank. My lights are one 9 hours and sump light on 24/7 with 55 watt 6500 bulb. I use ro/di water only, here are my water specs.

Calcium 355ppm
Alk 4mg/l or 11.2 dkh
Salinity 1.025
Temp 76'
PH 8.2
Ammonia 0
Phosphate 0.01
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 10

Now my problem is very time a put a anemone in tank it dies in one week, but my other corals are doing fine, leather corals, yellow polyps, duncan coral, mushrooms, some others.

Please can someone tell me what I'm doing wrong and need to fix. If you want pics I can send...

Thanks Les
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SGH360 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2011 at 5:53pm
how do you acclimate your anemone?

does it wander off then it dies off?
 
have you seen anything bothering the anemone? Your parameters are fine . 

when you purchase your anemone do you see it healthy?

How long does it take to reach LFS to your house?

Pics would also help if you need any help upload your pics to photobucket copy the IMG link and paste it.

Do you see the anemone melt?

 Do you acclimate your anemone to the lights?


Edited by SGH360 - February 08 2011 at 5:54pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bfessler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2011 at 6:20pm
I agree the water parameters are fine and the lighting sounds adequate to me, so we need some more information on the anemone and your tank itself. What other livestock do you have in the tank? I would be particularly interested in how you are acclimating the anemone and how it behaves in the first couple days after introducing it to the tank. Anemones will usually hide for a little while and then roam around till they find a spot that they like. A full tank shot would also help.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wickedsnowman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2011 at 6:48pm
I also think its an acclimation issue. Your Ca is a little low and your Alk is a little high but they are not out of range. Definitely not for a anemone. Also personally I like my temp at 78-80. I have come to the conclusion that might just be a preference thing though. With that said what type of species have you tried some are definitely hardier than others.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2011 at 7:19pm
It sounds like you know what you are doing, and I'll bet that includes acclimation too. Anemones are very hardy. I'll bet it's the tank itself. Some combination's of organisms just seem to make trouble for other organisms. What kind of anemones and how many?

Yes, pics please, especially a full tank pic
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigfishtoo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2011 at 7:37pm
Hello, I used the drip system for two hours driping into a bucket with anemone. Yes the anemone moved around and hide in the rock at bottom of tank. I didnt see anything bothering it, yes it was healthy looking, it takes four hours to travel home from the aqaurium store. bought it on january 28 and it melted away today. Put anemone in tank with all the lights off, until next day and ran only the vho, next day turned all the lights on.

Here is list of livestock---
1- black sailfin blenny
1- engineer goby 10" long
2- tomato clownfish
2- yellow damels
1- purple dottyback
1- black & white butterfly fish
1- green serpent sea star
50-turbo snails and other snails
I hope this will get some help to solve my problem I would love to have anemones in my tank, but at $80 each hard to have until problem is solved. I will try and take some pics of tank and post.

Thanks Les
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2011 at 7:47pm
Since you live so far from the LFS, you might consider transporting things differently than just in a bag of water. We can help you devise a method.

$80 Shocked  What kind of anemone?

What about the livestock that have a bigger impact on an anemone, like coral, LR and LS? And is there a Refugium on this tank? What kind of algae in the Refugium?
Pics of everything would really help here. Smile

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigfishtoo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 08 2011 at 8:31pm
The anemone was a rose anemone,40 gallon sump with some caulerpa. 70lbs of live rock in main tank with a 4 inch sand bed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 09 2011 at 7:40pm
I doubt it was anything you did wrong.
I used to have a job that sent me often to the mines at Carlin.
Since you evidently drive to SLC (or Reno?)to buy stuff, I suggest you get a home grown anemone next time. There must be at least 10 hobbyists here in SLC that have a field of cloned GBTA's and RBTA's (Green and Red Bubble Tip Anemones) in their tanks. Among friends here they usually sell for ~$30. 

The transport is as simple as a bucket 1/2 full of your tank water with a 1/2" layer of your LS, a peice of LR and some of that Caulerpa. The water is kept moving and aerated with a small air pump plugged into a power inverter which are only ~$30 the last time I saw one at Walmart. If you set up the bucket a few days before the trip, moving the LS and LR into the bucket submerged there will be little pollution to deal with and leaving the bucket open will allow enough light in to help the algae eat any N compounds. Place the bucket on the seat with you or on the floor so that it can be kept at least above 65 degrees. No need for a heater.

When you get the anemone, coral and/or fish, consider the bucket as your aquarium, which it is sort of. Acclimate them to the bucket by mixing a little water in the bags or by using another container the way I suggest in the Tips section of the Reefkeeping Tips below. Look in the tip "Secrets of adding new fish, fish training and the Miracle of Garlic Oil" I believe somewhere in there is where we discuss that a simple quick acclimation is generally best. If the bucket water is a bit colder than the bag, just let the bag sit for a while to slowly reach closer to the bucket temperature. More stress occurs when animals are set into colder water than when they are placed in warmer water.

Let us know.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigfishtoo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2011 at 6:34pm
Here are some picture of my tank, i hope they turn out, first time sending pics. Please let me know. sorry if not that clear.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bfessler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2011 at 7:03pm
Well one thing comes to mind and that's the huge Cinnamon clown. I had a large maroon clown that nearly killed my RBTA because it was to aggressive with it when hosting. The RBTA started out about the size of a softball and was only about the size of a golf ball before I took it out of the tank. It continued to shrink but is starting to make a comeback but it's only about the size of a quarter now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigfishtoo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2011 at 8:22pm
I never seen clown picking on anemone, but large one is the female and smaller one is a male. If this is the case I will give them away.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bfessler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2011 at 8:25pm
My clown wasn't really picking on it, more like loved it to death. Do the cinnamons host in the anemone. If not that's probably not the cause.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigfishtoo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2011 at 8:41pm
Hello Burt,
No the anemone was to small and never seen clowns around anemone when lights were on.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PDoug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2011 at 11:14pm
I would place my bet on chemical warfare are you running carbon to soak up toxins? I have always had issues with leathers and my other corals
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bfessler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2011 at 11:22pm
Good point. I haven't had any problems with leathers and anemones but then I don't have nearly as many and I do run carbon. A small anemone could be overpowered by all that cabbage leather.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigfishtoo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2011 at 11:26pm
Hello Doug,
Yes I hace a small filter bag with some carbon in it next to my skimmer in sump, maybe 3 cups of carbon total. I change it out every month with new carbon. Is this wrong to use? let me know.

thanks Les
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bigfishtoo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 10 2011 at 11:41pm
The anemone never came close to the cabbage leather corals, it was below them close to bottom. would a engineer goby eat anemone or tear it apart. I thought all these fish would be safe to have anemones in the same tank. boy I wish I had someone close bye to come by and look at set up. Need all the advise I can get, this site is the best for getting great advise from, please keep up the good work & giving advise.

Thanks Les

thanks Les
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wickedsnowman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 11 2011 at 12:34am
IMO I think 2 hours is to long of a acclimation period for a anemone. Especially after a 4 hour drive.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bfessler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: February 11 2011 at 9:45am
Hi Les,
 
Actually the anemone doesn't have to come into contact with the leather for there to be an issue. Leathers, as well as most soft corals, excrete toxins as a method of defense and to claim their space on the reef. In the ocean they are dissipated quickly but in our tanks they can build up and become toxic to some species. With as many cabbage leathers as you have it is very important to run ample carbon to remove the toxins as well as doing frequent water changes. Do a search on Soft Coral Toxins or Leather Coral Toxins for more information. Here is a link I found in a quick search. http://www.ultimatereef.net/forums/showthread.php?t=120934 There is plenty more infor available on this subject.
 
If you aren't running carbon the level of toxins may have been sufficient to affect the anemone before you ever added the first one. Here is what I would do before trying another anemone.
 
1. Put a pound of carbon in a media reactor, canister filter or even just a filter bag placed in a high flow section of the sump. The more water that can pass through the carbon the better. Run this for 30 days.
 
2. Do a large water change, at least 25% and replace the carbon. After 1 week add the anemone.
 
3. You can probably cut back to 1/2 pound of carbon changed monthly after that.


Edited by bfessler - February 11 2011 at 10:07am
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