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bbauman 
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 Topic: External vs. Internal Sump Pump?
Posted: July 16 2007 at 2:43pm |
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I'm new to this sump stuff, and I'm setting up a new tank soon. I was wondering what kind of pump I should buy - I need one in the 11-1500 gph range. I hear a lot of opinions but the main thing seems to be internal vs. external. Which do you prefer, and why? Pros vs. cons? Brand names? Thanks ahead of time!
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Mike Savage
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 2:47pm |
I've been happy with a Mag 12 internal but I would also like to know if there is enough advantage to the external pumps to justify the cost.
Mike
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GARFVolunteer
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 2:49pm |
Like Mike, I have a Mag 12 internal pump. If I had to do it over again, I would get an external pump to reduce the heat. External pumps heat the water much less than internal pumps.
Thanks,
Scott
Edited by GARFVolunteer - July 16 2007 at 2:50pm
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Dion Richins
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 3:22pm |
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Ive used both and would prefer to stay external. Less heat, Less noise IMO, More flow for the power used. I have a external that someone decided not to buy, that is available if your interested.
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Mike Savage
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 3:28pm |
Less noise? I like quiet and have always considered my Mag 12 to be quiet. Maybe I need to find out what quiet really is.
Mike
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Dion Richins
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 3:32pm |
I was running 2 mag 18 in my 125. I didn't think about it till I changed over to 2 external 1200gph and my family commented on how quiet the tank was.
Maybe I just had noisy pumps.
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Mike Savage
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 3:37pm |
I would trust the family's oppinion. 
Mike
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bbauman
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 3:44pm |
 Holdencraft 33 wrote:
I was running 2 mag 18 in my 125. I didn't think about it till I changed over to 2 external 1200gph and my family commented on how quiet the tank was.
Maybe I just had noisy pumps. |
What pump do you have for sale? How much?
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Dion Richins
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 4:13pm |
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gen x pcx40. Rated at 1190gph. It is a back up for the pumps on the tank. The tank pumps will be available in a couple of weeks. I'm changing over to a dart and using only 1 pump.
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bbauman
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 8:54pm |
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bump
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bbeck4x4
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 9:09pm |
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running a dart external closed loop. and a mag 3 for the sump. less heat in the water with great flow.
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bbeck4x4
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 9:32pm |
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one thing to add to the internal vs: external, I have been battling high temps, my tank this morning was at 79.9 this means that no metal hallides would be turning on today, at 79.6 one metal hallide will turn on,
in tank pumps
mag 3 for return from sump
skimmer pump
external pump
dart
lighting
one atintic 55 watt lamp that will stay on all day(not dependent on temp)
two 150 watt MH lamps on/off temp controlled(controlled by aqua jr)
central air running full tilt, house temp 78-85 deg.
tank cooling
two large fans behind the hood with the front of the hood propped open, max speed.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
so tonight in a act of desperation, I shut the central air off, (wasn't doing much good anyway) and opened the windows,
I pulled the power to the skimmer and the temp came down .1 deg.
so, I grabbed a very large fan and put in over the sump, temp came down .2 degrees
so, with the fan on the sump running, I plugged the skimmer back in.
temp stayed the same.
now 30 minutes later tank is now at 79.1 degrees.
that much difference from one fan over the sump. ( and not much water flow at that)
Edited by bbeck4x4 - July 16 2007 at 9:33pm
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GARFVolunteer
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 9:48pm |
Increasing the surface agitation where the fan is blowing across the water will make a large difference.
On my old 120 gallon, I could get the tank temp 2 degrees cooler by having a power head directed to the surface of the water where the fan was blowing. Evaporation rate would also go up by a gallon and a half or so...
I finally added the chiller when the tank temp was hovering around 82 degrees while evaporating 5 gallons a day. The two main sources for the heat are the MAg12(little) and the hammerhead(lot) pump. The lights add very little to the temp when compared to the pumps.
Thanks,
Scott
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Gahlenfr
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 10:04pm |
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I would do the same as Scott. I have a mag18 internal. My problem is 13ft head pressure from the basement and when I looked at the power curve vs power consumption the Dart would not push the flow I needed so when my basement is finished and the tank comes downstairs I will go with a dart.
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bbeck4x4
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 10:28pm |
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My thinking in not having a fan on the sump was that the low flow from the mag 3 would not be enough to offset the heat from the lights, boy was I wrong on that one,
almost an hour later and the tank is at 78.3 house is still at 85 windows open.
what I don't yet know is if the moisture from the tank is causing the hvac to freeze up or if it is low on freon.
or what the humidity in the house is now vs. what it was with the house closed up.
now, I need a way to mount this fan to the stand and make it safer than it is.
I will try adding a power head in the sump pushing water up, probably tomorrow, I want to see what I have done now will do for water temp before I add any more variables to this.
Edited by bbeck4x4 - July 16 2007 at 10:28pm
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Mike Savage
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 10:55pm |
Brian I'm glad that you found that a fan would help over the sump.
Mike
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bbeck4x4
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 11:31pm |
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I'll update tomorrow, hopefully I can keep temps reasonable with both MH lamps on, tank is now at 78.1 fans are off, house temp is still 84
so, to tie all of this back to the original thread, where is the heat from?
the two pumps in the sump, or the closed loop pump?
I doubt now that it is mostly from the lights(as I had originally thought but proved wrong when temps were high and no lights on, and two fans for light cooling)
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Mike Savage
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Posted: July 16 2007 at 11:45pm |
You will probably have to turn them each off in turn and check the temperature to find out.
Mike
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bbauman
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Posted: July 17 2007 at 4:41pm |
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Anybody else with a sump/pump want to contribute?
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PDoug
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Posted: August 01 2007 at 10:54pm |
I prefer internal the more contained the D#@$ thing is when it takes a dump the better IMHO
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