Election Committee
Printed From: Utah Reefs
Category: Main
Forum Name: Suggestion Box/Recommendations
Forum Description: This is the place to submit recommendations to the WMAS presidency.
URL: http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=22160
Printed Date: September 10 2025 at 6:42am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.03 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Election Committee
Posted By: larhalli
Subject: Election Committee
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 11:03am
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I think there should be an election committee made up of two or three paid members, individuals with integrity that are not running for office. These individuals would count the absentee ballots and the ballots at the meeting. And would report and decide on inappropriate or faulty ballots. This would be an honest and fair way to finalize our elections and would eliminate any impropriety.
------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Replies:
Posted By: Adam Blundell
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 11:11am
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Interesting... I don't think there is any reason for concern but if a club member thinks so then we should address it.
Although Mike Savage is running, would you be against him counting it up? Is there anyone you would trust more than Mike?
After the meeting the box will be taken to dinner and counted up... the absentee ballots (all four of them or so
 ) will be added and right off the bat Heil (assuming he wins against nobody) will know who is in the presidency.Well somewhat... the president and vp will still have the option to appoint more pres members to join the voted in members.
If you are concerned feel free to hang around after the meeting.
Adam ------------- Come to a meeting, they�re fun! |
Posted By: larhalli
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 11:25am
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I have been involved in many elections, some very political. Election committees have made those final results less combative. Those members running should be allowed to be present at the counting of the ballots or at least have some representative. I just don't think it is appropriate to have a person who is running for an office count the ballots. It leaves questions in the minds of those who may not get the votes they thought they should. As a side note yes I trust Mike and many others who are running. I am sure there are people I trust more but they may not be members. I just think there may be a need for an election procedure that should eliminate improprieties. ------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Posted By: Shane H
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 11:29am
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Hmmm, Last year we did not count the ballots for a couple of days. We wanted to make sure everyone got a chance to vote. Jake printed and placed the abesentee ballots in the box the night of the meeting. There were very few - and none came in after the meeting.
I believe I am an individual with integrity and I trust Silcox and now Will explicitly. Unless there is someone running against the president, I don't see a need to form a committee to count votes. The number of votes each candidate gets remains confidential, whether they win or not. Last year I kept all the ballots for about 3 months in case there were any questions.
If there is some question about ballot tampering or impropriety I would be very interested to hear more.
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Posted By: Adam Blundell
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 11:32am
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I think that is a great idea. I'm just wondering who should be on that committee. Right off Mike was the first person that came to my mind. Next up... Scott Morell since he is an outside member.... maybe Jon Finch since he isn't running.
I can tell you that 10 years ago we had some very close races. Two people really competing for president and the presidency positions were also quite close. Like 23 votes to 18 votes or so.
But in the last 5 years or so... not much competition. I've pretty well been able to predict who was going to get the votes before we even handed out the ballots.
Adam
ps- but every year someone will surprise me, so you never know ------------- Come to a meeting, they�re fun! |
Posted By: Debbles
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 11:37am
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As someone that is running for presidency council I have to say I have no problem at all with the way the votes are counted. You guys have my trust 100%.
Deb
 Yabba Debbie Doo! ------------- Yes Mikey...I still have fins!!! |
Posted By: larhalli
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 11:40am
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I think the number of votes each candidate gets should be posted whether they win or not. There should not be any secrets. Just another reason to have an election committee. Why do they need to be kept confidential? Is there some way a person would know who did not vote or who voted for them on the individual ballot?
------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Posted By: ssilcox
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 12:38pm
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Keep them confidential. Some of the council is appointed, some are elected. I would rather appoint someone that is going to kick butt and put in a lot of time in the presidency vs. someone that got elected and didnt do a darn thing (this happened many times in the last few years). I dont think they need to know if they are popular enough in the club to be elected vs. appointed. I am just wondering where this came from. Why all the sudden distrust in the system?
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Posted By: chk4tix
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 12:56pm
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Are there going to be the chance for absentee ballats? I would love to vote but I have prior obligations so I will not be at the meeting. ------------- Original Crappy Reef Club Member #2 |
Posted By: sukie
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 1:00pm
Ck this thread out http://utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=22143 - http://utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=22143 ------------- http://sukie.mt-wudan.com/ - My Blog |
chk4tix wrote:Posted By: Debbles
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 1:29pm
I agree!
Deb
Yabba Debbie Doo! ------------- Yes Mikey...I still have fins!!! |
Posted By: larhalli
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 1:33pm
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I just made the suggestion as a recommendation. There is no distrust in the system. I just think the system is not perfect. Why even have an election if the positions are appointed? Why don't we just vote for a President? Why doesn't the President just appoint who he thinks will make a good council? Or is that what happens anyway? I agree the President should have people that are willing to work for this club. There are people who will do a good job and I am sure there are a few who may not. So why have an election if no one knows the results? How do you know if someone is not going to do a good job unless given the chance? A lot of times, new blood are new ideas.
------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Posted By: Shane H
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 2:01pm
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Larry,
You make some great points. Don't think the election is somehow rigged. The top four vote getters become part of the presidency, others are appointed by the president and vice president as necessary. You may notice that the number of presidency members varies year to year, whereas the number we vote for (4) does not. Traditionally, appointees have been pulled from those who accepted their nominations because it is assumed that they want to be more involved. The reason I don't publish the actual vote count is to avoid hurting anyone's feelings. If the results remain confidential, then everyone on the presidency council should consider themselves the top vote getter.
In fact, last year Silcox and I (who ran unapposed) did not get the highest vote count! I appreciate your concerns and also your recommendation. If you'd like to be involved in the counting of votes, I am more than open to that, but we are not going to post the vote totals per candidate.
BTW, your last sentence couldn't be more true!  |
Posted By: larhalli
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 2:21pm
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I apologize if I offended anyone by making this recommendation. I am not the most trusting person in the world. I was involved with unions and was a union officer for most of my life until I retired. I just think the election process is something we should not take for granted. Maybe those who are not as popular and who are appointed need to know that they need to crawl out of their shell and meet people. If people don't do a good job, they need to be replaced with someone who will. I believe the President should be able to make that decision and we as members should support him in those decisions. If we don't agree then we must wait till next election and vote accordingly. I kind of feel like my votes don't really mean anything cause it doesn't really matter because I am sure that the President has already made up his mind on who he is going to appoint from the list of candidates. That is not why we have elections.
------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Posted By: Debbles
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 2:25pm
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Votes do count. The top four vote getters are elected.
------------- Yes Mikey...I still have fins!!! |
Posted By: larhalli
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 2:46pm
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The top four are elected, that's great but what of the other ten? Are they all appointed? If so why have an election? If there are only going to be ten positions then maybe the top ten vote getters should make up the council. I would hate to be the number 5 vote getter and not be appointed and possibly be knocked out of position by someone who may have not gotten any votes and was appointed by the President. My feeling is that too much discretional privilege leads to impropriety.
------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Posted By: larhalli
Date Posted: November 30 2007 at 3:03pm
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[QUOTE=Adam Blundell]
But in the last 5 years or so... not much competition. I've pretty well been able to predict who was going to get the votes before we even handed out the ballots.
Adam, I bet we could do it again this year. You write down your picks and I'll write down mine and then we can compare them after the meeting. ------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Posted By: Summertop
Date Posted: December 03 2007 at 2:28pm
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Larry,
I understand your concerns. I suggest you take Shane up on his offer to help count.
I do have a couple of points I would like to make...
1. The presidency does not control your work, your pay, or your lively hood. They are simply there to make sure the club is a benefit to the members. If it is not a benefit, people don't join/come to meetings.
2. As for elected vs. appointed positions. That is very common. Even as high up as the President of the USA. He gets elected then appoints his cabinat. The WMAS president MUST be able to make appointments. Take the job of webmaster. The club needs someone with the ability to do it. Same for treasurer.
3. I have been in the presidency for a few years. I have seen presidency members drop out. The president must be able to appoint replacements if needed.
4. To this day, I don't know if I was elected or appointed. If there were multiple candidates for President, I would like to see vote breakdown for that. But, I don't really care about seeing it for council members.
5. I have not talked to anyone that was offended by your request. EVERYONE in the presidency loves it when members care enough about the club to make suggestions and requests. Regardless the outcome of THIS request...please keep making them. I wish more members would voice their desires for the club. Obviously we wouldn't be able to implement every request, but if just ONE was implemented, it would be worth while. Again, thanks for the request...keep them comming! ------------- =========== Shawn Winterbottom |
Posted By: cl2ysta1
Date Posted: December 03 2007 at 3:40pm
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it is a valid point. People might feel more inclined to vote for someone they had to email their votes to or knew they were going to be seeing the actual ballots. =) ------------- I <3 Boxers Achilles tang lover |
Posted By: mikeden
Date Posted: December 04 2007 at 1:09pm
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Larry, I agree with your concept in general, and wouldn't be opposed to it.
But on the other hand, let's not make a mountain out of mole hill. After all, it's all about having fun with our hobby, conversing with those who share the same, and spreading information. I've only been a member of this board and keeping saltwater for a short time, but this community has been a huge help, and a source of enjoyment for me. I'm extremely busy, and hardly have time to maintain my tank, and I know a lot of others are in the same boat. Whoever is able to carve out the time to manage this... my hat is off to you, and you get my vote! The current presidency has done a great job, in my humble opinion, and the current voting system seems to have worked. Although not knowing them all personally very well, based on what I've seen of their performance thus far, they have my trust.
Just my 2 cents.
 Maybe we should put Hugo Chavez in charge?
 ------------- 150G Reef |
Posted By: chk4tix
Date Posted: December 04 2007 at 2:09pm
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Larry, I think you have a very valid point. How do you know who really wins if the people running are the one's counting. In any possition, people do not like changeg and will do anything to keep things from changing. The main point of my post is to let Larry know, I think he is right. ------------- Original Crappy Reef Club Member #2 |
Posted By: Jake Pehrson
Date Posted: December 04 2007 at 3:28pm
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I think there were some good points made during this thread. If there were more then one president running then this may be a bigger issue. Either way whomever is on the presidency next year can discuss this and make the voting process even better in the future. ------------- Jake Pehrson Murray http://coralplanet.com" rel="nofollow - coralplanet.com http://utahbeeranch.com" rel="nofollow - :) |
Posted By: chk4tix
Date Posted: December 04 2007 at 3:33pm
You are correct on that one. ------------- Original Crappy Reef Club Member #2 |
Posted By: larhalli
Date Posted: December 04 2007 at 4:03pm
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I just want everyone to know that I am more than pleased with the present administration and council. I am looking forward to another great year as well. My suggestion was just that a suggestion. In our democratic society we expect election results to be posted. The president of this club however needs to have people in his council he can trust and depend on. For the most part we all get along, we are like a family which has it's problems once in a while, people's feelings get hurt but the presidency seems to handle those small things for the best and make things right again. I would however like to know if the individuals I voted for were in the top four and would have liked to know that for the simple reason that if they don't do a good job we could vote them out next year and get some one in there that will do a great job. Maybe we should not vote for the council at all and just let the president make that decision for who he wants in his council.
------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Posted By: Jake Pehrson
Date Posted: December 04 2007 at 6:27pm
We have discussed that in past years. Having elected council members is a good idea IMO. It make the presidency not be so like minded. ------------- Jake Pehrson Murray http://coralplanet.com" rel="nofollow - coralplanet.com http://utahbeeranch.com" rel="nofollow - :) |
Posted By: Mike Savage
Date Posted: December 04 2007 at 7:05pm
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I agree. Some of them should be elected.
Mike -------------  |
Posted By: larhalli
Date Posted: November 10 2008 at 8:47pm
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I am sorry to bring this up again but as you all must know by now that voting is important to me. I am very pleased by what the past administration has done, but what is wrong with an election committee? I still think that individuals that are running for office should not be allowed to count the ballots. Did the past presidency ever discuss this subject and what were their decisions? If it is still the opinion of the presidency that the presidency should be appointed why do we really have elections? Is this an issue that should be like a proposition vote? One that maybe the members should be allowed to vote on?
------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Posted By: EagleEyez5
Date Posted: November 10 2008 at 9:27pm
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I agree with Larry 100%....I do think that there should be a commitee....also after reading through all of these posts, I think that half, 50%, 1/2, of the commitee members should be elected......I realize that the President of the United States appoints his own cabin, but that is why all of Congress is ellected, that way a 'dictator' cannot rule and take control....not saying that the club is run this way....
For the Presidency, I think that he/she should have control over who is Vice President, Sectretary, and two other positions. This would alow for 'equal' numbers of votes........ I am not saying that there two parties in the club, but maybe just more oppinions out there...... ------------- http://www.highendcorals.com/"> 
WMAS PAID SPONSOR |
Posted By: Shane H
Date Posted: November 10 2008 at 9:45pm
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What I think would be worthwhile is finding more than one person willing to run for president. Believe me, when the current president is ready to take a breather, it is VERY difficult locating someone willing to take over that position and convince them to run. You will notice that the last five or more years, the president has ran unopposed. I don't think this is because there aren't differing opinions, I thinks it because being president, or on the council for that matter, takes work - and most are not willing to step up. If Larry and Jerry want to count the votes, I say stay after the December meeting and count the votes. Provide this information to Adam (or whomever becomes president) and then, let them run the club. I'm still 100% against posting vote totals.
BTW, if you want change, now is the time. Proclaim your nomination and campaign away.
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Posted By: chk4tix
Date Posted: November 10 2008 at 10:20pm
I remember this thread.... Can I be President??? (just kidding....I'm not that insane. )
------------- Original Crappy Reef Club Member #2 |
Posted By: Adam Blundell
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 8:26am
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Heil's idea isn't bad at all. If anyone wants to count the votes, and you aren't running, just stay after the December meeting and count them up.
I'd rather someone else count them than me..... it is great to say "don't blame me I didn't count the votes"
By the way.... seeing how many people have accepted nominations there may not even be reason to count votes. It doesn't look to me like many people are willing to do the work of being on the presidency.
 Adam ------------- Come to a meeting, they�re fun! |
Posted By: jpiotrowski
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 8:56am
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It doesn't look to me like many people are willing to do the work of being on the presidency.
This attitude sure keeps me from running. Just because I don't run I am not willing to do the work? I would probably win the overall vote but lose the electoral.
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Posted By: Adam Blundell
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 9:05am
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John, if you are willing to help out then I say run! Some years everyone who ran got in.... and that actually happens all the time in the smaller clubs.
Adam ------------- Come to a meeting, they�re fun! |
Posted By: PeggySue
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 10:12am
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Larry, thanks for bringing this subject up again, it's an important one.
I agree with John on this. Why is it that you have to be on the presidency to help out? And why can't you help out if you aren't on the presidency? ------------- Famous last words, "Parks, Recreations & Tourism" |
Posted By: pa_reptileman_4
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 10:17am
i'll run, this outta be fun
 ------------- pitiful guppy tank. shane |
Posted By: pa_reptileman_4
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 10:17am
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gotta give adam a run for his money. ------------- pitiful guppy tank. shane |
Posted By: Adam Blundell
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 10:21am
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That is a great point!!!!!
You certainly don't have to be on the presidency to help out. We can use help from everyone. And, some club members help out in ways we greatly appreciate. For instance Carolyn and those refreshments, the club members who donate corals to the frag swaps, club members handing out reef tour flyers, club members being on the reef tour.
There are a lot of ways to help out!
I was just trying to say that if you know you have certain skills or the time to give, please run for the presidency. For instance if you like giving presentations we need a TOTM person, if you like working with spreadsheets we need a membership person, if you have the ability to make newsletters we need a seastar person, if you have webdesign experience we have projects for you, we need someone to run the merchandise table, etc.
If people are thinking about helping the club, I'd encourage them to run for presidency because I'd love to see them get a position where we can all continuously benefit from them.
Adam ------------- Come to a meeting, they�re fun! |
Posted By: PeggySue
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 10:22am
excellent! ------------- Famous last words, "Parks, Recreations & Tourism" |
Posted By: sukie
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 10:23am
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Because that's the job you volunteered for . . . Not all the members/nonmembers see it - but the to maintain the club is a lot of work and it's based on the few people that 'volunteered' to give their time to do it. Sometimes we call upon the members for help but most of the time it's up to the elected/appointed presidency members to keep the forum up, meetings every month, etc. If you want to help then run. |
Posted By: Adam Blundell
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 10:26am
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Oh, and I should mention that my favorite people are whoever the people are that set up and put away chairs. I don't care if they are presidency members, club members, visitors, kids, friends, whoever.... people that jump in to help out get my appreciation
Adam ------------- Come to a meeting, they�re fun! |
Posted By: pa_reptileman_4
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 10:31am
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ok so maybe i wont run for president, but i wouldnt mind being on the presidency ------------- pitiful guppy tank. shane |
Posted By: Adam Blundell
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 10:34am
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Shane, I'll go nominate you....
Adam ------------- Come to a meeting, they�re fun! |
Posted By: larhalli
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 10:51am
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Wow! You can count me in for helping to count the ballots then. I would love to help out more also. Unfortunately there are Thursday nights when we have the meetings that sometimes I can not make it to them. For this reason I would not seek a position on the Presidency. I agree with Sukie that if you volunteer to do the job you must be there and do it. I for one, appreciate the dedication of our club's officers and all they do. I am sure it takes a lot of your time. I am glad we have those few who are dedicated enough to do the job. I am also sure there are more people that would love to help out but are just not certain on how they would fit in with those already that are officers or on the Presidency. Maybe they are just a little bit too shy to get involved but would be an asset and could really help out. I say just get involved.
------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Posted By: PeggySue
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 11:12am
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I don't have anything to say here, I just want to watch this thread and I can't find a 'watch thread' button. So I'm posting instead. ------------- Famous last words, "Parks, Recreations & Tourism" |
Posted By: Shane H
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 11:23am
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Larry - thats the spirit. Believe me, there is a lot more going on than spending time at the meetings. We agreed as a presidency that meetings are mandatory for council members, but as you know things do come up and many of us missed some meetings last year.
As to the question - why do you have to on the presidency to help out? We have tried multiple times to form committees for special events; BBQ, reef tour, Valentines meeting and some have been hugely successful, but unfortunately most have not. It ends up that the presidency members do the work when committee members fall out. What naturally occcurs is that it just becomes easier to do the work, than to form a committee.
If someone wants to help, but cannot commit to being part of the presidency, they should just speak up. Just ask Jerry what happens when you speak up.
 You get a monthly meeting to do! We would love to have someone volunteer to put away chairs or shovel snow at the meeting house, someone who would post flyers for our special events, someone who would drive our guest speaker to the airport at 7:30 am on a Friday, or someone who would decorate for special events. There is plenty going on that anyone could help with - just stop one of the presidency and say - "Hey, how can I help?" |
Posted By: sukie
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 11:24am
At the top of the thread there's a button that looks like this - on the right side: If you click on the button it will give you an option to watch the thread. As for the election committee - I am tired of this issue coming up each year. We should just do it this year and post the results. Elections are all about popularity contests, if you don't get the numbers you were hoping for and still get appointed then obvious we think that you would benefit the club with your help. It's all about the club in the end!  |
Posted By: bannshy
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 11:24am
I have to agree with both Larry and Jerry here. Allthough, I do think there are more than one party, and it goes beyond how to set up your tank. I have seen a ton of smart well thought out ideahs thrown under the bus. The statement "I am not going to do this or that" really shouldn't be the position of the president/ presidency. We should be finding new ways to grow the club and new ways to increase the range of reef/fish husbandry.
I work 2 jobs now and can no longer make the thursday meeting or any weekday meeting. so I can't really offer to help as part of the presidency unless those meetings are on saturdays.
Jeremy
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Posted By: Shane H
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 11:27am
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I have seen a ton of smart well thought out ideahs thrown under the bus.
Jeremy - please share. And please define "thrown under the bus".
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Posted By: larhalli
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 11:30am
Amie, there is a watch topic button on the top. Click on Topic Options. ------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Posted By: bannshy
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 11:41am
http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28523 - http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=28523
http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=27869 - http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=27869
there are other examples of good Ideas- like why don't we have a frag swap the the members can bring their own corals to sell. the club could make money by either charging a cover charge or 10% of the sold corals or a table fee.
I am not saying that every idea got thrown under the bus I am say that the presidency should not have that attitude so please don't take this as a personal attack it real isn't.
it is about find improved ways to move the club forward. I really have a lot of respect for all those who have put in all the extra time for the club.
Jeremy
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Posted By: bannshy
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 11:42am
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I would fix my spelling grammer errors but I don't want anyone to think I wrote something mean and then took it back.
Jeremy
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Posted By: PeggySue
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 12:02pm
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Thanks Sukie and Larry, I found the Watch Thread option. I'll use it in the future. ------------- Famous last words, "Parks, Recreations & Tourism" |
Posted By: cl2ysta1
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 12:28pm
I was the one who made a suggestion for changing the frag swap based on many previous frag swaps I've been to in other states what work very well ------------- I <3 Boxers Achilles tang lover |
Posted By: bannshy
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 12:47pm
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I know, I loved the idea Cl2ysta1 that is one of the reasons I think you should be vice president with EagleEyez5. Please except the nomination http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=29135&FID=9&PR=3 Jeremy |
Posted By: Shane H
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 12:50pm
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The presidency reviews each recommendation at presidency meetings. We address questions like: 1) Do we have the resources (manpower / money) to implement this recommendation? 2) Are there other websites that offer this service? 3) Will the general population of the club utilize this recommendation? 4) What are the maintenance requirements of this recommendation? 5) Has this recommendation been tried before? What were the results?
I record the comments and we take and informal vote and I post the decision on the MB (I am deliquent in this regard). There is no bus and no throwing. We review each recommendation regardless of who posted it or how crazy it may initially sound.
I know this sounds pretty boring and mostly controversy free (bummer), but thats how its done.
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Posted By: Jake Pehrson
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 1:26pm
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Just to back up what Shane said, we do review and talk about each recommendation made to the presidency at our presidency meetings. Many of the recommendations made by members have been implemented (some have been implemented and then abandoned due to various reasons (resources, money, logistics, lack of interest/support etc.)). ------------- Jake Pehrson Murray http://coralplanet.com" rel="nofollow - coralplanet.com http://utahbeeranch.com" rel="nofollow - :) |
Posted By: bannshy
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 2:14pm
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I appreciate your open answers - again I am not trying to stir up "drama" - I am stating what I want in a presidency. Maybe the term "thrown under the bus" was the wrong term. sorry I really don't want to offend anyone.
Jeremy
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Posted By: EagleEyez5
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 3:29pm
This is the kind of suggestion that we need more of.....which is why you will be a great asset to the club in a leadership position..... VOTE FOR CRYSTAL and by association, Jerry for president ------------- http://www.highendcorals.com/">
WMAS PAID SPONSOR |
Posted By: larhalli
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 5:14pm
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Wow! I guess we are getting people involved. This is going to be an interesting year. I noticed that someone forgot to mark Mike Savage in bold. I am sure he accepted the nomination. I am sure it may be just an oversight.
------------- Larry Halliday West Jordan |
Posted By: pa_reptileman_4
Date Posted: November 11 2008 at 6:31pm
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yes it should be a very interesting year. ------------- pitiful guppy tank. shane |