I have a 4x65 watt PC over my 75 gal. They are CSL 50/50. I would like to get a bluer color. I was wondering if I were to put a NO 40 watt actinic with the PC's would it make that much difference. I am just looking for a couple of guesses before I put the money out. Thanks.

T/A

Geez, you just pinged my other pet peeve

Yes if your PC atinics are anything like mine (36 watt Jalo) you'll be AMAZED at the difference between fluorecents and compacts.  Come have a look if you want.  Next bulb change you might consider using 6700K bulbs in the PCs and VHO (or NO) atinics.

If you're a DIY kinda guy, check out the thread in the diy forum for opinions on balasts, ect. 

It is pretty bad when you think about it you would think the PCs would make a good actinic. I was just wondering if just 1 NO 40 watt actinic would be sufficient.

T/A

I have CSL 50/50's too and I'm not very happy with the "actinic"  I posted on nanoreef about it:

http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10313">http://www.nano-reef.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10313

There is a picture of a CSL bulb and a Coralife bulb side by side.  The Coralife peaks around 420 I think, that is why it is more purple. 

I haven's seen anything that is better than URI VHO's for actinic... IMO

Quote: Originally posted by Transam on 09 April 2003

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It is pretty bad when you think about it you would think the PCs would make a good actinic. I was just wondering if just 1 NO 40 watt actinic would be sufficient.

 

T/A

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Good lookin' tank, mark.

Wow!  This is very interesting......

Mark and I disagree on some things but when it comes to the basics of aquariums and how people should run their tanks we almost always agree.

However, Mark, I must say I disagree with just about everything you just wrote.  This is really strange, because I can't believe that over the past 7 years we've known each other, we haven't really discussed this topic.  Metal Halides are fantastic, and I've never seen an aquarium that was over lit in my life.  Also, I don't think blue lighting is all that important for a reef tank.  The blue light is what we add for our enjoyment.  Sure blue light is all you find in the deep, but that is not where all the corals are found. 

I applaude the new hobbiests who are anxious to get metal halides and blast their tanks with white light.  It's either do that now, or do it in a few years when you decide you need it.  I don't think there is really a debate in the hobby over halides.  I thought everyone agreed that they can only enhance an aquarium.....

am I wrong?

Adam

MH are a waste of money. Tell me why, on a limited budget, I should buy MH when a very nice looking tank can be acheived without them!

I am starting to think that we have to overilluminate for the Zooxanthellae to overproduce because we can't feed as much as we need!

Those Lights of America power compact lights are great but tend to burn out within a year. I have used them a lot! Don't recommend them any longer.

Differing viewpoints are welcome

Hey!  I've found common ground on at least one topic with Adam!  Lighting!  I think there is no comparison between halides and fluorescents.  Excuse the pun but they are like night and day.  The visual effect and intensity of a MH bulb is incredible compared to a fluorescent and the point-source lighting they provide adds a lot to the visual impact of any tank. 

I do agree that there are many organisms that can get by with the light provided by fluorescents but for many hobbyists the corals that interest us the most do best under very strong, intense lighting (such as most SPS corals).  As for the over illumination of a tank that Mark suggested I think that�s incorrect.  I�m amazed every time I view the SPS Keepers Forum at http://reefcentral.com/">reefcentral.com and see all the people using multiple 400 to 1000 watt MH bulbs over their tanks (some tanks as small as 75 gallons).  My own 75 gallon tank is lit by two 250 watt MH bulbs and two VHO actinics and I�ve yet to experience any problems with corals/inverts I�ve placed in there, they look and grow great. 

Cost is the only drawback I can see when going with halides and even this can be minimized with some DIY skills.  Replacing 6 fluorescent bulbs isn�t much less than a couple of MH bulbs�  I�ve never used any PC bulbs though so maybe these reduce the cost even further.  Someone else can likely discuss this better than I.

Quote: Originally posted by Mark Peterson on 16 April 2003

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MH are a waste of money. Tell me why, on a limited budget, I should buy MH when a very nice looking tank can be acheived without them!

I am starting to think that we have to overilluminate for the Zooxanthellae to overproduce because we can't feed as much as we need!

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Blanket statements will usually get some contradiction!  Even with MHs our tanks don't come close to the intensity of natural sunlight in the tropics.  Some people like to keep corals from shallow areas (many SPSs) where the light is full spectrum too.  The fact that so many reefers use (the more expensive) MH should account for some credit (or maybe we're all sheep?).

I actually agree with all of you! 

You can find beautiful tanks of all kinds at all kinds of costs. The biggest difference seems to be how much effort the owner puts into finding what works for him/her.

Quote: Originally posted by Mark Peterson on 16 April 2003

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MH are a waste of money. Tell me why, on a limited budget, I should buy MH when a very nice looking tank can be acheived without them!

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I worked at "The Aquarium".  From experience the beginner aquarist would always go for the cheapest route: NO, PC or just VHO never a MH-VHO combo.  With in three to six months they were in buying the MH-VHO combo, because they saw the difference in appearance and they were moving into higher light care of animals. 

I have seen several tanks with SPS corals ran under VHO lighting only, I personally think the specimens in my tank (SPS) would not like the conditions that a VHO setup would provide.  I will have pictures of my tank in the "Tank of the Month" for May. 

Quote: Originally posted by Adam Blundell on 16 April 2003

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*snip*  Also, I don't think blue lighting is all that important for a reef tank.  The blue light is what we add for our enjoyment.  Sure blue light is all you find in the deep, but that is not where all the corals are found. 

*snip*

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Now, I could be wrong in my understanding here, but I think Adam is right regarding the redlighted statement above.  My feable coral/zoo/photosynthesis understanding follows:

The reason (or part of the reason) that corals fluorece or glow under atinic lights is that the coral produces a protein that absorbs the "blue" light. It then uses some of that photon energy to power the zooxanthellae photosynthesis and reemits the energy as light at a lower energy level (frequency).  This process is a net producer of energy for the coral, but the coral must expend some energy to get there (kinda equivalent to activation energy in some chemical reactions...don't get the glazed look over your eyes :) ).  Thus atinic (blue) light makes the greens/yellows glow.  UV light would possibly make the blues/purples glow.  Light, already in the PAR zone, would directly feed the zooxanthellae.

That's my understanding, I'd welcome comments/opinions regarding this subject...it is interesting (to me).

Jon, excellant description of atinic lighting.  IMO, my tank is doing much better with the combination of lighting I am running now.  Five bulbs totaling 440 watts of light, light the tank.  The five bulbs consist of 1, 175 watt (10,000K, Aqualine Metal Halide) on for ten hours.  The remaining 4 bulbs (3, 24� 75 watt and 1, 18� 40 watt) are VHO Atinic 03 lighting.  They are on one hour prior to the Metal Halide, and continue on for the ten hours during, then remain on for one hour after totaling 12 hours).  The hour before and after the Metal Halide imitates the sunrise and sunset.

I was running the same lighting with this difference, 2, 24 " 75 watt 50/50 VHO's with  1, 24" 75 watt VHO atinic  03 and 1, 18" 40 watt VHO atinic.  This resulted in a very white light on the tank. My corals have been doing remarkable sense the change about 3 months ago.

John

JBruse,

Take the 250w MH and add two 400w MH and three 110w VHOs. That would rock over your new tank. With 30" in depth, you're gonna need some serious light to get to the bottom. 

Or ... forget trying to keep SPS corals and go for a lower light tank. That would be unique and less $$$$.

For anyone who is interested, I kept tons of soft corals and LPS under two 150w halogen and two 40w NO actinic bulbs for several years. The halogens are very yellow, but also intense. I can e-mail some pics if anyone is interested. This pic is of my clowns in a long tentacle anemone under the halogens and NO actinics...

Coralline growth was excellent but, I could not keep any SPS coral under the halogens. Regardless of how close they were to the light source. So - like the other "sheep" I now have MHs!