WMAS Discussion Forum : Closed Loop http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/ Copyright (c) 2006-2013 Web Wiz Forums - All Rights Reserved. Sat, 25 Jul 2026 23:21:56 +0000 Sat, 18 Nov 2006 09:26:17 +0000 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Web Wiz Forums 12.03 360 www.utahreefs.com/forum/RSS_post_feed.asp?TID=15157 <![CDATA[WMAS Discussion Forum]]> http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/1by1.gif http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/ <![CDATA[Closed Loop : 3/4&#034; is too small, except...]]> http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135196&title=closed-loop#135196 Author: Mark Peterson
Subject: 15157
Posted: November 18 2006 at 9:26am

3/4" is too small, except perhaps for a Nano. In fact, we had a demonstration conducted by JFinch at one club meeting which showed us that for most of our aquarium pump applications, the pumps do the best flow when the return piping is 1" diameter. It should be even larger for the intake side.

As for keeping the intake screen clean, the basic principle is, the larger the intake screen surface area the less suction at any one point in the intake grid. Low suction pressure means the small and large bits of algae and other stuff that floats around will not suck up to the inlet, stick there and clog it. Smile
 
I once made an inlet screen by sewing together a sheet of plastic canvas which is used for needlepoint. I used fishing line to sew it together into a tube and then sewed one end shut flat. It fit over a 2" diameter pipe. This plastic canvas may be what Scott used for the closed loop intake screen in the tank pictured above.
 
For example, the basic idea is used on the Rio Powerhead. You will notice that the large strainer box that fits over the pump intake rarely needs cleaning, and rarely clogs to the point of restricting flow.
]]> Sat, 18 Nov 2006 09:26:17 +0000 http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135196&title=closed-loop#135196 <![CDATA[Closed Loop : larger or more will lessen the...]]> http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135151&title=closed-loop#135151 Author: bbeck4x4
Subject: 15157
Posted: November 17 2006 at 5:17pm

larger or more will lessen the impact if one of them starts to get plugged up.

Brian
]]> Fri, 17 Nov 2006 17:17:04 +0000 http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135151&title=closed-loop#135151 <![CDATA[Closed Loop : I am actually about to buildan...]]> http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135137&title=closed-loop#135137 Author: Broman
Subject: 15157
Posted: November 17 2006 at 3:38pm

I am actually about to build an HOB closed loop and have already purchased the parts for it.  I am planning on using a 3/4" strainer connected to pvc which runs into a mag drive 9.5 pump.  The strainer will be about halfway down in my tank, hidden behind some rocks.  I am planning on using grey pvc so it stands out less.  Does anyone have any ideas/opinions about this or how it could be improved?
 
Mark - I would love to hear your tips about keeping the intake clear!
]]> Fri, 17 Nov 2006 15:38:47 +0000 http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135137&title=closed-loop#135137 <![CDATA[Closed Loop : I was not able toconvince the...]]> http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135065&title=closed-loop#135065 Author: GARFVolunteer
Subject: 15157
Posted: November 16 2006 at 10:24pm

I was not able to convince the Planning and Zoning comittee (aka the lovely and gracious Monica) to allow me to drill my new tank so I did an external closed loop.
 
Here is the intake. It is made with 4" ABS pipe.  It is pulling around 5800 GPH
 
Here is the manifold:
Here is what it looks like in the tank:
 
Thanks,
 
Scott


Edited by GARFVolunteer - November 16 2006 at 10:33pm]]> Thu, 16 Nov 2006 22:24:35 +0000 http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135065&title=closed-loop#135065 <![CDATA[Closed Loop : Mark is correct, you want the...]]> http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135041&title=closed-loop#135041 Author: bbeck4x4
Subject: 15157
Posted: November 16 2006 at 5:09pm

Mark is correct, you want the intake separate from the overflow, mine is in the bottom of my tank(I would have drilled it in the back but the hole was there already when I got the tank) sorry if I misunderstood your question,
here is a link to a picture of my old setup, I moved it to the back, and raised it higher(it sucked in sand occasionally in that spot, and with the rockwork sitting on it would have been tough to clean, it is 2" in diameter.

Brian
edited to add picture of new location in tank, raised it higher, and it is hard to see in that pic, but I can get my had around the back to remove it if it ever needed cleaning.


http://picasaweb.google.com/bbeck4x4/InletOfClosedLoop/photo#4998132320554975250


Edited by bbeck4x4 - November 16 2006 at 5:12pm]]> Thu, 16 Nov 2006 17:09:09 +0000 http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135041&title=closed-loop#135041 <![CDATA[Closed Loop : Mark&#039;s description of the...]]> http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135036&title=closed-loop#135036 Author: TNaisbitt
Subject: 15157
Posted: November 16 2006 at 4:26pm

Mark's description of the flood is exactly what happened to me.  I had the same "great idea" to put the intake of my closed loop into my overflow.  It looked great but it caused two floods (I'm a slow learner I guess) before I finally yanked it out of there and just put it in the main tank.  It was actually siphoning water from the closed loop output back into the sump through the overflow.  A couple of backflow valves would have probably fixed it, but by that time I was down to the last straw.  Since it has been in the main tank I haven't had any problems.

I was on Reefcast (see link on Melev's site) when I heard of Melev talking about some perforated black pvc that he used on a closed loop that virtually disappeared (See Episode 9).  Here is a link to it:

http://www.aquaticeco.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/product.detail/iid/8559/cid/2079

Anyway, after a while my intake was covered in coraline so it blends in.  I also rearranged the rock in my tank to help hide it from view.

Hope this helps.  Good Luck!



]]> Thu, 16 Nov 2006 16:26:31 +0000 http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135036&title=closed-loop#135036 <![CDATA[Closed Loop : Mark - Thank you, that makes sense...]]> http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135031&title=closed-loop#135031 Author: Jewnyer
Subject: 15157
Posted: November 16 2006 at 2:09pm

Mark - Thank you, that makes sense to me.  I'll have to figure out a new way to go with that.  It's either figure out the closed loop or I can get two Seio 1100's on a Seio controller to provide my flow.  Thank you for your help.]]> Thu, 16 Nov 2006 14:09:42 +0000 http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=135031&title=closed-loop#135031 <![CDATA[Closed Loop : The intake screen and return outlet...]]> http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=134997&title=closed-loop#134997 Author: Mark Peterson
Subject: 15157
Posted: November 16 2006 at 12:31am

The intake screen and return outlet for a closed loop should both be in an area that can never go dry. The whole idea and efficiency of a closed loop is that it takes water directly from the tank and returns it directly to the tank. Think of a powerhead - it draws in and spits out from the same body of water. This eliminates the need to push water uphill as does a pump pulling water from a sump or overflow area and pushing it up to the tank. An overflow creates a new body of water so it is not the place to put the closed loop intake. If it were plumbed that way and the pump failed or the power went out the tank would back siphon all the water back through the output nozzle -> down into the sump, overflowing the sump right onto the floor.  And as has been stated, all the water flowing over through the teeth of an overflow is needed by the return pump. The whole idea of a closed loop is that it must be separate from the overflow.
 
An intake screen for a closed loop must be accesible. It tends to clog up and must be cleaned. There are some tips I can share, if you are interested, about keeping intake screens clear, requiring less cleaning. Smile


Edited by Mark Peterson - November 16 2006 at 12:34am]]> Thu, 16 Nov 2006 00:31:56 +0000 http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=134997&title=closed-loop#134997 <![CDATA[Closed Loop : acuramech:if the return pump stopped...]]> http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=134981&title=closed-loop#134981 Author: Jewnyer
Subject: 15157
Posted: November 15 2006 at 10:38pm

acuramech:

if the return pump stopped pumping for any reason and the water droppedin the overflow would this cause any problems for the closed loop pumpor would it just maintain enough in the overflow to run the closed loop.

That's what I was thinking, because you will just be circulating x amount of water throught the closed loop pipes, the water level should remain the same even if the return pump went out and the tank stopped draining.  I could be wrong.   I'm also only using a Mag 9 on a 72 bowfront so I think I should be fine and wouldn't need to open the teeth up.  But then again, I'm not sure, that's why I'm asking the board.

bbeck4x4:

you will need to have a large screen on the intake(think pond strainer)to keep fish and snails out, being a closed loop if the pump stoppedwhere would the water go, it wont leak unless the pump sprung a leak,very rare.

You think strainers found on most hang on back overflows would do?  Or something like the strainer included in those all glass aquarium overflow kits?

Thanks for the response so far, keep em coming!
]]> Wed, 15 Nov 2006 22:38:51 +0000 http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=134981&title=closed-loop#134981 <![CDATA[Closed Loop : you will need to have a large...]]> http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=134979&title=closed-loop#134979 Author: bbeck4x4
Subject: 15157
Posted: November 15 2006 at 10:25pm

you will need to have a large screen on the intake(think pond strainer) to keep fish and snails out, being a closed loop if the pump stopped where would the water go, it wont leak unless the pump sprung a leak, very rare.

Brian
]]> Wed, 15 Nov 2006 22:25:01 +0000 http://www.utahreefs.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=15157&PID=134979&title=closed-loop#134979