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FU-Reactor - my first big DIY project

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thefu View Drop Down
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    Posted: March 03 2009 at 8:08pm
So, after looking high and low for a CA reactor that would fit not only my cabinet but my wallet as well, I came to the conclusion that only a custom design would do both. After scouring the internet reading at least a hundred threads and maybe 500 posts, I came to the conclusion that the DJ88 design from melevsreef.com would be the design I would model after.
 
My requirements (in addition to the basic requirements of any good CA reactor) were that it could not look too "rigged" or hokey (no offense, but toilet flanges were not my cup of tea) and it had to have a good, two chamber design that maximized my available space.
 
Below are a couple of the docs I used to design it up and today I picked up my acrylic from Delvies Plastics downtown. Tomorrow I will be putting it together with the help of plastics-expert Tongue Dave Anderson out at his place. Hopefully I will have a good portion of it done and we will have it at Dave's table at the club meeting.
 
All in (plastic, fittings, pump, CO2 tank, regulator, solenoid, bubble couter, etc.) is coming in at under $300 so that makes me happy.
 
I will post photos of some of the fabrication soon.






Edited by thefu - March 19 2009 at 11:11am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aquarium Creations Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2009 at 8:20pm
That looks like the unit i built 8 years ago, Does anyone still have one that i built? I used a o ring lid that was cnc cut.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shane H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2009 at 9:02pm
Eric - I've still got one and I know Dave Tea has one as well. I'm planning to put mine back into service with the next big tank.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sculpin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2009 at 9:20pm
Thats killer man! Good luck with the build and take lots of photos.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aquarium Creations Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 03 2009 at 11:08pm
Thats funny, After years its still a cutting edge design Thumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thefu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2009 at 8:43am
So, after speaking with FIRE SHRIMP at the club meeting, he placed me into doubt whether or not this is a two stage CA reactor. After studying the design and the write up on the design on melevsreef.com I think I have come to the conclusion that we are both somewhat right. I will explain.

In a two stage design, the idea is to take the effluent out of the recirculation chamber (where media is mixing with the CO2, lowering the PH, and disolving the media) and then put it through another vessel of media before introducing it into the aquarium. The idea is that this second pass through the media will "consume" any leftover CO2 in the effluent by having it react with the media outside the recirculation chamber (where new CO2 is always being added).

Now, in this design above (DJ88 design), there is no real separate chamber from the recirculation. That is where FIRE SHRIMP is correct. However, since it is an "up/down" design with a recirc bleed off at the top, a portion of the CO2 will naturally collect at the top of the unit to be bled off, and the water (with less CO2) will be pulled down through the second chamber to be recirculated.

I do not know how the two designs will differ in the PH of their effluent. Only a test would be able to determine that. Anything else would be speculation from either of us I think.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tileman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2009 at 9:11am
One thing to consider if you are worried about haveing low ph water being introduce into your tank, thus lowering your overall ph.  I run a kalk reactor also to counteract the calcium reactor, does that make scents?  All of my topoff water runs through a kalk reactor before hitting my sump. This means all of my topoff water is high ph, keeping my overall ph very stable night and day. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shane H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2009 at 9:57am
I did the exact thing that Brad describes above. I ran a kalkwasser reactor (you may have seen it at the March meeting) in conjuction with my calcium reactor specifically to keep the pH up. 
 
If you have any demand for alkalinity/calcium, then a simple method to drip kalkwasser into your aquarium is, IMO almost a must.  You're adding top off anyway, why not make it work for you in two ways? (stable salinity AND alk/calc additions)
 
Just for your info, the pH of the effluent leaving the kalkwasswer reactor is about 12, while the pH of the effluent exiting my calcium reactor was about 7.


Edited by Shane H - March 07 2009 at 10:53am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thefu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2009 at 9:58am
Ya, I have seen that method. We will see where it rolls out to once I get it up and running. I can still easily add a RO canister with a down tube and media onto the effluent line to create a "true" two stage at a later time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aquarium Creations Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2009 at 10:13am
I agree with the statement but its still a single chamber reactor here is why, as long as first chamber is open to the second chamber the ph will be the same on either side, in that design the two sides are being recirculated, this would be easy to test when you get it running. run the reactor for a week then collect some of the effluent test the ph then take off the lid and test the first chamber if i am correct the ph will be the same. but either way its a easy fix
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thefu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2009 at 10:20am
The point is that on one side, there will be more CO2 than the other since CO2 rises to the top and less will be drawn down on the second chamber as opposed to a purely top to bottom design. The second "chamber" in this design will be drawing down water with less CO2 than was remaining in the first chamber because it will stay on the top and be recirculated through the CO2 bleed off.

But, ultimately, the true test IS the test and all the theory and speculation on either of our parts will succumb to that Tongue

Thanks Eric for your insight.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aquarium Creations Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2009 at 10:56am

NP,

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sculpin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 07 2009 at 3:14pm
Would there be a problem of adding a small secondary chamber to the system? I saw the reactor at the meeting and it looked like there was some extra room. If you used a small tube around 3" wide I'm sure it would fit. You really wouldn't even have to go high tech. Just use a piece of 1/4" hose to run to the bottom of it and a simple pipe fitting for the top. 

Just a thought.


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Edited by Sculpin - March 07 2009 at 3:15pm
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Ya. My plan is to use a RO canister with a downtube if I decide the ph is still too high on the effluent. Or the other option is to just create an acrylic cylinder with tapped endcaps for john guest fittings.

I got my co2 cylinder and regulator today. I will be finished with it next week and fire it up. Not only has this process saved some dollars it has been fun and educational. I now understand how these things work much better.
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Clap
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thefu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2009 at 11:28am
OK, so I finished the CA Reactor and have been running it for a little more than a week now. I have got it balanced out and it is putting out enough effluent to keep the tank at 11.5-12 dKH and about 480 Ca. The Ph of the effluent stays in the 7-7.15 range and my tank has not decreased much in Ph at all (from 8.15 to 8.05).

Here are some notes and following that are some photos.

Issues that arose where I learned the hard way:

- center divider piece which also acts as one of the support legs is made from two pieces of 1/4" acrylic sandwiched together. It is important to glue these together first before putting into the main assembly as if they leak on the top or sides inside, it will flow through to the bottom and seep out. I found this out the hard way as this was one of my first leaks I had to seal.
- The initial pump I was going to use was a Hydor 20. Total POS in an external use application. Leaks like crazy despite manufacturers claim it can be used externally. I took this out and went to a Quiet One 2200
- Slight mismeasurment to allow for top fittings will mean a mod is necessary for my cabinet drawer to slide in and out (no biggie)

Things I did right that are important to note

- Water test first by connecting input to output with a hose but no pump. Fill with water. Dry off completely. let sit for at least two hours and then inspect for tiny leaks. Note the leaks, drain, let dry, then use #3 to fix them if any (this is how I found the issue with the center divider)
- For the top gasket - 3M pressure sensitive double sided tape (stuff with red backing) worked great. This is NOT the white foam tape. This tape works good in that it is about 1/16" thick, but will give (compress) and has a dense cell structure. (Thanks Eric - Fire Shrimp for the tip at the meeting)
- Use alot of screws (stainless) on the lid, mine has 24. One about every 1.25". This allows you to not have to crank down on the screws too much. This is important especially if you tap the acrylic for the screws.
- The reactor holds two containers of CaribSea ARM media!
- The top CO2 recirc works beautifully.
- Using tee into return pump worked beautifully (see photo below) for supply pressure
- fits beautifully in my cabinet but is a PITA to get it in and out. (thank goodness this will not be often.

Here are some photos





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thefu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2009 at 11:36am
Here are the photos, BTW some of you may have seen this on the Daves acrylic table at the last club meeting.















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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Andreason Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2009 at 12:10pm
How much do you estimate the cost at?
Andreason's

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thefu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March 19 2009 at 12:18pm
Acrylic - Cast - $50 (precut from Delvies)
Pump - $40
Plumbing and fittings - $30
Screws - $5
3M tape $6

CO2 tank and regulator with bubble counter and solenoid - $115

ARM media 2 x $12 - $24

So, everything except the PH controller is $270 (this includes media and CO2 parts). This is probably half what the same would cost new, and it wouldnt fit so perfectly in my space and hold so much media and it wouldn't have been as fun or educational either.

If one has the apptitude for working with their hands, a mentor, and patience I definitely recommend it.


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