Hobby fading? ?New LFS - Reef Legends

I agree with all you said ttabbal. And there is another proof that other hobbies are going to FB as a main method of communications... sucks! 

Baccara wrote: "While that doesn't mean his new shop will be" Pretty rude comments and I am sure your lack of encouragement was not appreciated.

It appears you skipped over the explanation. I've never met Skyler or had any interactions with him to make any kind of "judgmental" comment about him or his store. I'll go edit it now to catch any additional selective readers.

Funny how something that was actually meant to be a very positive comment on the thread was read so negatively by people. Having never knowingly met either of you and yet I get comments like that makes me wonder where the grudge toward me comes from? The post is updated and I think states what I was originally trying to say a little clearer. Hopefully that helps.


Edited by Krazie4Acans - December 02 2015 at 2:14pm

I've only been in this hobby for a few years now, but it seems like there is always the concern that the hobby is drying up (pun intended.) I think it just cycles. There are the dozen or so that are the rock solids and then the rest come and go. I know there are a lot more tanks popping up in Davis county. Just in the past couple months, I've met 4 people with new tanks and I know of 2 more that are setting them up. So, I don't think it's fading.

Regarding LFS, I'm going to lay it all out there from my point of view which I don't know if it's the typical hobbyist's view or not, but here it goes. I can count on 1 hand the times I've bought corals from a LFS. It seems to me that there is a premium to buy from a LFS. From a local hobbyist you can get GSP for free and I've seen them for for $25 at the LFS. $5 or $10 corals from other hobbyist are $25 or $30. The high end stuff is limited in selection because of limited demand for it. So, if I want a JF "something" or a WWC "something", I usually buy it online from them. The exception to that for me is RMF who I do buy corals from.

Fish, on the other hand, are a different story. I've never bought a fish online and I don't plan on doing it. I also know a place around that has the cheapest fish by far, but every fish I've bought from them has died within a few months and it always seems like their fish tanks are full of ick. So, I would rather pay a higher price for a healthier fish. I also don't mind paying a little higher price for a captive bred fish as I think that's important to sustaining the hobby in the long run, it helps understand the propagation of different fish species in the ocean, and the fish normally do better for me; they're out more, they eat better, etc. My go to places for fish are Aquatic Dreams and Reef Oasis. I've always had really good success with the fish I've gotten them.

Going forward:
What I would want from a fish store is I can look online or go in, tell them the fish I want, they order it in, quarantine it, treat it for a few weeks (with various treatment methods to make sure it would be disease/pest free), make sure it's eating, and then I go get it. Or, the fish go through that process and so when I go in, there's one all ready to go. Obviously that would raise the price of the fish as it would cost to do that and the survival rate for the LFS would be worse (but overall I think the rate would be better for the hobbyist), but I would love to have all my fish be quarantined and I don't have the space or resources to do a proper job of it at home.    
I've often wondered my boards like R2R get so many thousands of people on at a time. Monday was their 24 live sale and at 2:00 in the morning, on the 1 thread, there was still 500 people on it. I think it boils down to 3 things.

1. (The most obvious) Their pool is a lot bigger being a national club so of course they're getting more.

2. The online fish stores are heavily involved. They are constantly doing promotional things, posting updates, new corals FS, etc.

3. Deals-I admit, I am a sucker for a good sale. The online stores are constantly running live sales, specials, discounts, contests, giveaways, etc. and people flock to those. Our LFS stores run an add when a new shipment comes in or a 20% off deal every once in a while. But I'm an emotional buyer. I like to see it, get excited about it and get it right then! If it's a blanket -20% OFF SALE- add, i just ignore. I have no emotional investment into it. But, if I see a macro shot of a sweet looking rainbow blasto and it's normally $120, but SALE $99! I get excited and I want to click and buy that thing! And it's contagious and pretty soon I'm checking all the time to see when I can get another sweet deal!

I think if we could get the LFS to be more involved with the club and on the board (and a little more reasonable on common coral prices) I think we would see a jump in activity and then the stores would see a jump in sales. Right now the main thing the board is for is hobbyist classifieds. Which is great and all, but if we want more people to get involved, it needs to be more than that.   

The retail can be profitable as Bird world has been open for many years and doesn't do maintenance. They are also a full service pet store and not just saltwater fish and inverts. They do sell tanks and will do setup for a fee but then it is all on the customer from that point on. So, it can be done but maybe not a just a saltwater store.

And puppies and birds.

I agree 100% with Hogie's comments above.  I will not overpay for an item I can find cheaper elsewhere.  LFS is almost always priced higher than something on sale online.  I do support LFS for livestock because of shipping, handling.  I do like to drive to the store to look at fish, coral and find something that catches my eye.  Having an LFS is nice but not needed.  I live about 30 minutes away from the closest LFS, making the drive is a nuisance sometimes.  Nothing worse driving down there and not finding what you need.  Sure they can order it, but so can I.  Online has a much better selection, can shop multiple vendors and always get the best deal.  You can argue benefits of an LFS but to most people it will always come down to money.   

Edited by Chevmaro - December 03 2015 at 2:57pm

I'd go to the meetings... who needs online national forums and videos?  The social aspect is what makes it worthwhile.  

Mark Peterson wrote: Good points above. Since 1993, I've seen a good dozen or so LFS come and go, hence the question in the OP. I believe the WMAS people are a small percentage of the number of total LFS customers. Until recently, I typically approached everyone I could, to tell them about the local club and give them a WMAS business card. A couple of times I got in trouble for doing it inside the store.  All LFS except one, don't want the WMAS distraction in their store, even though they may voice support for the club. Having made these contacts, it seems surprising that our relatively active local club is still quite unknown to most hobbyists. I would have thought that in this day and age where information is so easily available, that people would find a reference to utahreefs.com as they searched the internet. Evidently not - OR - like Adam pointed out, they just don't have a need or a desire to look into it.  Aloha, Mark   P.S. <span style="line-height: 13.44px;">Is Skyler of Reef Legends the same Skyler of a few years ago that had a LFS in Utah County and had some dealings with hobbyists here?</span>

P.S. Yes

Chevmaro wrote: I agree 100% with Hogie's comments above.  I will not overpay for an item I can find cheaper elsewhere.  LFS is almost always priced higher than something on sale online.  I do support LFS for livestock because of shipping, handling.  I do like to drive to the store to look at fish, coral and find something that catches my eye.  Having an LFS is nice but not needed.  I live about 30 minutes away from the closest LFS, making the drive is a nuisance sometimes.  Nothing worse driving down there and not finding what you need.  Sure they can order it, but so can I.  Online has a much better selection, can shop multiple vendors and always get the best deal.  You can argue benefits of an LFS but to most people it will always come down to money.    Club meetings and guest speakers.  Why leave my house when I can read forums and watch youtube?  Have any of you seen BRS TV?    If the forums are slow, you should consolidate category's.  It will make it appear more active and people more likely to post.

+1...I agree with everything said here

The seen for the LFS is changing, I will agree with you guys on that most stores will be Maintenance companies with an option to open to the general public. I did the same thing Mark, yes it is me, Mark. I shifted my business model to be more of a 1:1 interaction with those who come in. They won't have to worry about finding someone or asking for help because the room which is the size of an office space because it is in an office complex gives you an awesome experience while in the showroom, with the exception to Friday which it was a packed office for most of the day..... Reef Legends is mainly an aquarium maintenance company, we are not open on the weekends and are only open 3-7 Monday-Friday.