Thanks for the info Shane,like Jeff was saying it would be nice if this kind of information was on a pamphlet for new guys like us.

I do not suggest adding any borate (borax) to your buffer mix.  Seawater is only about 5 ppm boron and is not really consumed in reef tanks.  So, I think you will get enough from your saltmix.

Are there any benefits?

Yes, borate is a wonderful buffer.  Better then carbonates at keeping pH at 8.3.

Any downsides?

Yes.  Since it is not readily consumed in your tank, it will slowly accumulate.  Borates are included when you test for alkalinity.  Normally, borates only account for about 3% of your total alkalinty, so we just ignore it and assume all of our alkalinity is due to carbonates (the good stuff that corals need).  But as it accumulates, more and more of your alkalinity measurement will be borates and not carbonates.  So you might think you have an alkalinity (due to carbonates) of 3 meq/l but in reality it might only be 1 meq/l carbonates and 2 meq/l borates.  Your corals will suffer due to the low carbonates.

The other issue is that at levels around 50 ppm it becomes toxic to some aquatic life.

Would you just use the 20 Mule Team Borax?

Yup, if I were to add borates, I'd use 20 Mule Team.

Did we talk about this on the way to Boise?

I don't think so.

Is this enough questions for one post?

I'm always game for more

...Kents SuperBuffer dkH and saw that it contains borate salts. So, I'm wondering why they add this?

They add it to help maintain pH, imo.  It likely contains a very very small amount.  But do not use Seachem Marine pH 8.3 Marine Buffer.  It contains HUGE amounts of borate and can raise havoc in a reef tank.  It's likely ok for a fish only though.

DIY Buffer for the new people :

5 parts baking soda
1 part washing soda (you can bake baking soda at 300F for 2 hrs to make washing soda)

It's as simple as that!

how long is it good for?

A really long time.  Don't worry about it going bad.

And do you just add let's say a tsp of powder straight to the water, or add it to your water change water that sits for a day or 2?

Just add some to your make-up water, let it dissolve and then slowly pour it into your sump or tank.  The amount to be added depends on the size of your tank and your current alkalinity.

I see so many that say alkalinity should be 8-12dkh, but my test strips give my results in ppm (I will be upgarding testing equipment soon) but let's say my test strip has 180ppm is this Ok or does it need to be raised, and how much of this homemade buffer should be added?

There are three ways to describe alkalinity (kinda like there are two ways to describe temperature, degrees F and C):  meq/l, dKH and ppm CaCO3.  And

1 meq/l = 2.8 dKH = 50 ppm CaCO3

So your 180 ppm = 180/50*1 = 3.6 meq/l or

180/50*2.8 = 10.1 dKH

You're alkalinity is just fine (assuming those test strips work).

what Calcium additive do you use as your part B?

Kent's Turbo Calcium is the most common.  The DIY crowd uses Peladow or Dowflake (or Prestone Driveway Heat) calcium chloride ice melt.  Those are the only brands I would try.

Also if you have been using B-ionic on your system for a few months, and switch to the Homebrew system what is a good starting dose on a 95 gallon tank w/ 125 gallon gross system?

First off, I personally don't recommend using just baking soda and calcium chloride in place of B-ionic (although there are folks here that do and appear to be successful at it).  B-ionic also contains a bunch of other elements found in seawater that aren't in baking soda.  But as for how much to use... how much B-ionic are you using now?

15 ml of B-ionic is equivalent to 3.5 g of baking soda (about 1 tsp) and 2.3 g of turbo calcium (just under a tsp).

What other essentail elements does it add that I don't get from my weekly 5% water change, or as long as I keep up on the water changes will I be okay to switch to DIY buffer?

If all you add is NaHCO3 and CaCl2 then over time as the CO3 and Ca are consumed by your coral, the remaining Na and Cl will accumulate.  This is what is refered to as "ionic imbalance".  B-ionic contains all the other elements found in seawater to "balance" out all the excess Na and Cl.

Or is the B-ionic fully worth the $$ based on performance and benefits.

*shrug*.  I really like B-ionic for a low-medium calcium demand tank, but you might want to speak to people using just baking soda and CaCl2 too.

What are those who have a calcium reactor supposed to do to get those elements that B-ionic add?

When you dissolve coral skeleton, you don't have those excess Cl and Na ions so an ionic imbalance doesn't occur.  And the idea is that whatever elements that were needed for coral skeleton growth will be dissolved in the reactor and added to the tank for new coral growth.

Just looking for my best, most cost effective solution.

Kalkwasser every day with the occasional "boost" from baking soda and CaCl2 when/if needed. 

Kalkwasser is definatly the most difficult additive to dose.  It's unforgiving.  You must watch your pH.  But it's not so difficult that you can't do it.

Is it your opinion that Kalkwasser is better than B-ionic, or just more cost effective?

Just more cost effective.  If cost was not an issue, I'd throw my kalkwasser and calcium reactor in the garbage and only use B-ionic!

Maybe I'll give it a go, but I think I need a surefire dosing method that
won't cause ulcers

If you're afraid to drip then how 'bout doing what Julian Spung does (and still suggests).  Add 1/8 - 1/2 tsp of kalk to 1 quart of RO water, stir it up and just dump it into your sump.  Do this every day just before going to bed (and maybe even every morning too).

Oh I forgot...

Don't let me or anyone else pressure you into doing something you're not comfortable with.  There are many ways to maintain alk and calcium in a reef tank.  Chose one that you're comfortable with.

jfinch wrote: Kalkwasser is definatly the most difficult additive to dose.  It's unforgiving.  You must watch your pH.  But it's not so difficult that you can't do it. Is it your opinion that Kalkwasser is better than B-ionic, or just more cost effective? Just more cost effective.  If cost was not an issue, I'd throw my kalkwasser and calcium reactor in the garbage and only use B-ionic! Maybe I'll give it a go, but I think I need a surefire dosing method that won't cause ulcers If you're afraid to drip then how 'bout doing what Julian Spung does (and still suggests).  Add 1/8 - 1/2 tsp of kalk to 1 quart of RO water, stir it up and just dump it into your sump.  Do this every day just before going to bed (and maybe even every morning too).

Jon, I am trying to cost justify either a Kalkwasser or Calcium reactor versus the B-Ionic that I am currently using.  Can you help me justify one or the other or both?

TIA

If we just look at the usage cost, here's what I come up with:

B-ionic (@$35 per 2 gallons - mail order pricing): $3.31 per 1000 meq of alkalinity

Kalkwasser (using cheap pickling lime):  $0.15 - $0.35 per 1000 meq

Calcium reactor (figuring $30 in CO2 and $20 in 15 lbs of substrate):  $0.37 per 1000 meq

If your tank is 100 gallons and it consumes 0.4 meq/l per day then you'll go through 55,188 meq of alk per yr. 

Using B-ionic that would cost: $183 per yr

Using kalkwasser:  $8.30 - $19.32 per yr

Using calcium reactor:  $20.42 per yr

So roughly speaking, for this hypothetical tank, you would save about $160 per yr by using either kalk or a reactor.  Or in other words, if you were to spend $400 on a calcium reactor it would pay for itself in about 2.5 yrs.  On the other hand, you can drip kalk without spending hardly anything on set-up so it'll start paying for itself from day one.

Jon-
That is excellent information.  Are you sure on those figures and may I quote you on them?

Adam

You can quote me on that.