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Sailfin tang: UPDATE

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Tyler Stewart View Drop Down
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    Posted: April 04 2005 at 11:27am
I have a red sea Sailfin Tang and I was looking at it this morning and saw that he has little black dots on him.  It does not look like it is a parasite but something in his skin.  I dont know if it is normal or what.  Maybe I am not feeding him properly.  Can somebody tell me how often I should be feeding him and how often I should be feeding him Nori.  My book also said that I should feed him broccoli, zucchini,  and leaf lettuce.   What do you guys think?  Do I feed him that stuff on a clip?  HMMMMMMMMM

Edited by 24tardo
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Mark Peterson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 04 2005 at 11:39am
24tardo, Those black dots are some kind of organism. I don't know what they are but I've seen them on my Yellow Tangs before. Eventually they went away. Watch them closely, add garlic oil to the meaty food and you will probably be okay.

Yes, Tangs need lots of veggies. Nori is an excellent veggie if you don't have Caulerpa or other macro to feed. If the belly of an herbivore is not always fat, it is not so healthy.

Are you having a number of problems lately? Would you like to discuss your aquarium's overall health?

Edited by Mark Peterson
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tyler Stewart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 04 2005 at 12:12pm
I'm not really having a lot of problems.  I am just getting everything settled since the move from the 15 gal to my 65 gal.  Everything else in my tank seems to be ok. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 04 2005 at 12:22pm
That's good to hear. If you need macro, I picked up a bunch from Renee on Saturday. Feel free to drop by.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jake Pehrson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 04 2005 at 12:23pm

Sounds like Paravortex or "black spot disease", also called black ich.  It is a parasitic flatworm.  The good thing is it is not as deadly as ich (or other parasites) and will rarely kill your fish.  The bad news is it is hard to get rid of.

Here is what I recommend.

#1 Freshwater dip fish, making sure the freshwater has the same pH and temp of the saltwater and is aerated well.

#2 Vacuum the top of the substrate often, until the black spot disease disappears for a couple of weeks.

Also garlic may help, but I don't think it is as effective on black spot as it is on ich.



Edited by Jake Pehrson
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tyler Stewart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 04 2005 at 12:34pm
How in the heck am I going to catch him without tearing apart my tank?  What causes "black spot disease"? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jake Pehrson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 04 2005 at 3:27pm

Originally posted by 24tardo 24tardo wrote:

How in the heck am I going to catch him without tearing apart my tank?  What causes "black spot disease"? 

Luck.

If you can't catch him I would try the garlic and vacuum the substrate.

What causes "black spot disease"? 

It is a flat worm.  Its existence causes it.  You must have got it from somewhere.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tyler Stewart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 05 2005 at 11:14am

I tested my water this morning and found that my Nitrates were kind of high.     (I guess)

Here are the results:

Am: 0

Ph: 8.0

Nitrates: 20

Nitrites: 0

I dont have tests for Calcium and Alkalinity, but I plan on getting them tested this week.

Let me know what you think.

Thanks,

Tyler

(I went and visited Randy at MSM for some Garlic Extreme and he really helped me out.  I had a bad experience with him before and vowed that I would never go back, but I did and I am glad I did.  He was really nice and really informative.  You can tell that he knows his stuff.  He even opened the retail just to sell me some Garlic extreme.  Really nice guy)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jake Pehrson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 05 2005 at 11:33am

The nitrates probably aren't effecting your fish at all.  20 is actually pretty low.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tyler Stewart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 05 2005 at 11:44am
Cool, I guees I dont need to freak out about that.  I gues I will kepp feeding him the food/garlic mix and gravel vac until I can catch the little guy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jfinch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 05 2005 at 12:19pm

20 is actually pretty low.

Are you saying 20's low for a reef tank or a fish tank?  I think that's high for a reef tank and likely low for a fish tank (definatly low for a freshwater fish tank).  I agree that 20 ppm nitrates is not likely to be any problem for fish.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jake Pehrson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 05 2005 at 12:41pm
Originally posted by jfinch jfinch wrote:

20 is actually pretty low.

Are you saying 20's low for a reef tank or a fish tank?  I think that's high for a reef tank and likely low for a fish tank (definatly low for a freshwater fish tank).  I agree that 20 ppm nitrates is not likely to be any problem for fish.

I should have clarified.  20 is pretty low for a saltwater fish only tank (20 ppm in a freshwater is almost impossible, unless you do huge water changes IME).  20 ppm of nitrate is probably not effecting his fish.

20 ppm in a reef tank is a little on the high end, but still acceptable IMO.  I don't like the nitrates to get much higher then that.  Obviously the lower the nitrates the better.



Edited by Jake Pehrson
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 05 2005 at 4:35pm
Thanks for the info that it's a flatworm. That info fits in nicely with my experience with it.

I have a suggestion for anyone that really feels the need to eliminate them without removing the fish. Add a couple drops of Flatworm Exit to the tank every day until the day the black spots have disappeared.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jake Pehrson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 05 2005 at 4:38pm
I don't like flatworm exit, but it may help solve the problem.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tyler Stewart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 06 2005 at 11:04am

Where can I get Flatworm Exit?

Thanks everyone for helping me.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark Peterson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 06 2005 at 12:55pm
I had to ask Bird World to order it, but that bottle is gone. Do a search. I remember someone bought some recently and posted. If you need their phone call or PM me.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tyler Stewart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 08 2005 at 11:22am

UPDATE:

I made a fish trap out of a 2 liter bottle and it worked.  The first one I caught was the sailfin.  I got him out and did a nice fresh water bath for him.  I dont know how long I am supposed to leave him in the RO water but I left him in there for 2 1/2 minutes. He is doing well today but the spots are still there.  I am thinking it might take a couple of days before the spots are gone.  That fish trap was awesome because I caught my Flame Angel along with it.

AWESOME!!!!!

Thanks all

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carl Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April 13 2005 at 11:54am

Personally, I am not so sure that it is flatworm. However, since I have never had to deal with it I am most likely wrong in this case.

When I went over to Tyler's house last week the black (actually a darker shade of gray) spots or lines were rather irregular. They appeared to be scrapes since from what I could see they were on the surface. This wen along with the ich issue that he has been battling recently. On sailfins and alot of lighter colored tangs, ich is often difficult to see... unless you look at their fins. The sailfin had the ich parasite on its fins. I then attributed the dark gray, irregular lines as scrapes which the sailfin then demonstrated while I was there.

Either way, hopefully you are able to get it worked out Tyler. Your tank is looking very nice.

In Syracuse

"I believe that forgiving them is God's function. Our job is simply to arrange the meeting." - Gen. H. Norman Schwarzkopf
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